check/call check/call check/raise the river

[cardcounter0]

A very nice analysis. Good post. But I am not questioning value betting the river. I think you do value bet the river. But when a check/caller calling station doesn't just call your value bet, but instead puts in a check/raise, do you call make the crying call?

To me it shows the player has jumped a level in the meta-game. Instead of "hey I have a hand, therefore I bet" he is taking into consideration your actions and knows you are going to bet your hand and can get another bet in by check/raising.

A player thinking at that level can also put you on a hand, TPTK, and will raise if he has that hand beat. Pretty basic, not a river bluffer.

Of course, you can't fold every time a fool thinks he has you beat and pulls a check raise, but I am thinking given your read on how passive the player is, it is a very low percentage of crying calls.

With some players, who I have seen only raise with the absolute nuts, you would never make a crying call. But that is just me. I guess some people would still call if the pot was *really* large.

maybe stick a few examples up, the discussion has been pretty good.

like i said i would probably fold to a river checkraise ~1/10 times but it is probably a leak of mine

[nomadtla]

There are some players I never call. Some I allways call (if I see something like Spota posted happening regularly from them). Then there is the middle range, which I usually divide up as so bassed on my assesment of how they play.

I roll a 6 sided die and if the following # or #'s come up I call.
Straight Up (ABC poker): 1
Deceptive (top quality TAGS and Lags): 1, 2
FPSer's (not a deceptive player but one who seems to at least pay attention and take shots, usually in an obvious manner, a lot of TC's fall here): 1, 2, 3 (as these are the ones I want to get the lesson, and the fish at the table see them as the good ones cause they make fancy plays and are more likely to notice the guy who won't be bullied by them)

These dice rolls are arbitrary when I have no other clue and it's HU. I don't use them offten but I think it randomizes and keeps me away from calling to offten. Though as I said in my earlier post in this thread I offten want to call them down and to my better judgement abandon the dice.
But it's a good idea in theory and works well when I'm not tilting away chips.