Could I have gotten away from this hand?

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why check the flop? it seems the MTT board slowplays the stupidest hands to slowplay.

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I checked the flop because it was a monster, I needed to let a weaker hand catch up some or at least let someone else bluff at the pot first to make a good profit on the hand.
Too often the first person to fire at a paired flop takes the pot down and I'm just too greedy for that. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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1.) A straight or flush can outdraw you
2.) This hand is not a monster
3.) Sometimes extracting the most value, or losing the least, is not always the move you see on the World Poker Tour.

[ansky451]

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I checked the flop because it was a monster,

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Thats not a real reason. Do you think its more deceptive when you slowplay? I'd be way more likely to put you on trips if you check the flop.

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I needed to let a weaker hand catch up some or at least let someone else bluff at the pot first to make a good profit on the hand.


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Thats just not true. You are ensuring that you will win a small pot or lose a big one. JQ on a 2 spade, semi connected board IS NOT A MONSTER. You think its a mosnter cause you have trips? Theres a million straight and flush draws possible, and if they hit you will lose a big pot.

Please go to the MHNL or Small stakes board, and see what they say about giving a free card on boards like these.

I would probably lead the flop...

Anyway, the turn action seems really weird if he don't have anything and with his check on the river, I think I check behind here 80% too just because of the turn action. It may be weak but he may aswell have a J like me (of course, my kicker is nice) but he could just aswell have a full house, knowing we will bet out. I check the river.

[yvesaint]

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I needed to let a weaker hand catch up

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exactly what kind of "weaker hand" catches up on a JJ8 board

the only scenarios i see where that happens is if the Q falls and he holds 9T, or if MAYBE another 8 falls

every other "weaker hand" that catches up now beats you (pockets hitting sets, Js hitting kickers, straights, flushes, etc.)

this flop is terrible to slowplay

[darydarling]

Yeah you can get away from this hand. Fold preflop.

Not once did you try and define your hand and where it stands preflop, on the flop and on the turn where he bet you raised, he reraised and you reraised bigger and he called I consider a check behind on the river or call a bet.

[darydarling]

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I might check behind on this river, but I'm not sure about that (I'd rely on his timing and tells) and wouldn't get to it this way.

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I think a more interesting question is what you do if it is checked to you on the river assuming you just call the turn raise, which is almost certainly what I'd do as well given these stacks.

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Completely different situation if you just call his turn raise and he checks the river.

But when it's reraised huge and he calls that, flares have to go up.

[Bandgeek]

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I needed to let a weaker hand catch up

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exactly what kind of "weaker hand" catches up on a JJ8 board

the only scenarios i see where that happens is if the Q falls and he holds 9T, or if MAYBE another 8 falls

every other "weaker hand" that catches up now beats you (pockets hitting sets, Js hitting kickers, straights, flushes, etc.)

this flop is terrible to slowplay

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Ok perhaps you're right about slowplaying the flop.
However in this instance any size flop bet wouldn't have made villian fold and I still lose the hand.
So my real question still is, on this flop in an unraised pot would you put in your whole stack with QJ?

[gumpzilla]

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Completely different situation if you just call his turn raise and he checks the river.

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Of course. Also more interesting, to my mind.

I'd also like to point out that "fold preflop" is not a helpful piece of advice here. Limping behind with QJ on the button with stacks this deep is extremely reasonable.

[darydarling]

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I needed to let a weaker hand catch up

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exactly what kind of "weaker hand" catches up on a JJ8 board

the only scenarios i see where that happens is if the Q falls and he holds 9T, or if MAYBE another 8 falls

every other "weaker hand" that catches up now beats you (pockets hitting sets, Js hitting kickers, straights, flushes, etc.)

this flop is terrible to slowplay

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Ok perhaps you're right about slowplaying the flop.
However in this instance any size flop bet wouldn't have made villian fold and I still lose the hand.
So my real question still is, on this flop in an unraised pot would you put in your whole stack with QJ?

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It's not always about getting the villain to fold his hand, but defining a range of hands.

If you bet the flop and he calls you have to assume he caught something.

When he checks the turn and you bet and he raises, now the range becomes clearer ...you can call and maybe call a bet on the river without getting all your chips in.

If he pushes you all in on the river you have to seriously consider folding.

[MLG]

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Could I have gotten away from this hand?

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How hard is it to not give away the results of the hand in the title people. I havent read any of the posts (since you deleted the hand in your original one) but im guessing you flopped a really good hand or a monster, and somebody flopped either a bigger hand or drew out. Most likely you shouldnt have found a fold at the end, but you played the pre/flop badly.

Learn to separate the decision from the result.