Dear Christians: why doesn't god DO something?

I love your post. It's a good one.

But logic is why I believe in a greater God.

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If you are a believer, and God doesn't exist, what do you lose?


[/ QUOTE ] Valuable time and energy that could have been used elsewhere including helping others. If you believe your god doesn't want you to experiment with stem cells, you might lose the cure for many deadly diseases. If you believe your god is against condoms, you might lose your life or the lives of others to AIDS. I could go on and on with these types of things. You might also lose your ability to have the sharpest mind you could develop because you short-circuited your development of logical thinking. Imagine if science books were half filled with brilliantly deduced arguments and half filled with fuzzy and flimsy take-it-on-faith arguments. Would that book produce the most productive scientists?
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If you are a non-believer, and God DOES exist, now what do you lose?

[/ QUOTE ] Yes, if I don't believe in the Christain god and the Christian god does exist, then I could lose big. Just as a believer in the Christian god could lose big if a non-Christian god exists.

Here's another question for you with my answer already included.

What Do I Lose If God Doesn't Exist But I Live In A World With Some People Who Believe That He Does?

Quite possibly my life! Right now there are terrorists who will gladly kill infidels if they have the chance. What if god doesn't exist or even if he does but he isn't their god giving out those particular instructions. Then I and you and everyone else on the planet could possibly be killed because of some believer's wrong-headed beliefs. This is a distinct possibility if you live among religious believers. There are passages in the Bible and many other "holy" books which could logically be interpreted as a call by believers to kill those who don't. This has happened many times in the past and easily could happen again in the future, maybe even easier in the future because of the potential misuse of technology. This is the biggest danger of religion. All it is going to take in the future is for one die-hard believer to have access to a WMD and believe that his holy book/god wants him to kill infidels and we could all be doomed.

That's all that's at stake if people continue to believe in made-up stories. Nothing to worry about, right? Maybe by the time our grandchildren run things, religion will have faded away. If it hasn't, I don't see much light at the end of the tunnel for the human race if religious fundamentalism stays popular and WMDs are readily accessible. That includes Christianity.

[Aytumious]

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Actually, I believe the thread was about "Christianity is +EV.

I'm saying believing in a God is +EV (with tongue in cheek).

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Flatline provided reasons why your logic is flawed earlier in this thread.

You are basically using Pascal's Wager to attempt to make your point.

Pascal's Wager

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If you are a believer, and God doesn't exist, what do you lose?


[/ QUOTE ] Valuable time and energy that could have been used elsewhere including helping others. If you believe your god doesn't want you to experiment with stem cells, you might lose the cure for many deadly diseases. If you believe your god is against condoms, you might lose your life or the lives of others to AIDS. I could go on and on with these types of things. You might also lose your ability to have the sharpest mind you could develop because you short-circuited your development of logical thinking. Imagine if science books were half filled with brilliantly deduced arguments and half filled with fuzzy and flimsy take-it-on-faith arguments. Would that book produce the most productive scientists?
[ QUOTE ]
If you are a non-believer, and God DOES exist, now what do you lose?

[/ QUOTE ] Yes, if I don't believe in the Christain god and the Christian god does exist, then I could lose big. Just as a believer in the Christian god could lose big if a non-Christian god exists.

Here's another question for you with my answer already included.

What Do I Lose If God Doesn't Exist But I Live In A World With Some People Who Believe That He Does?

Quite possibly my life! Right now there are terrorists who will gladly kill infidels if they have the chance. What if god doesn't exist or even if he does but he isn't their god giving out those particular instructions. Then I and you and everyone else on the planet could possibly be killed because of some believer's wrong-headed beliefs. This is a distinct possibility if you live among religious believers. There are passages in the Bible and many other "holy" books which could logically be interpreted as a call by believers to kill those who don't. This has happened many times in the past and easily could happen again in the future, maybe even easier in the future because of the potential misuse of technology. This is the biggest danger of religion. All it is going to take in the future is for one die-hard believer to have access to a WMD and believe that his holy book/god wants him to kill infidels and we could all be doomed.

That's all that's at stake if people continue to believe in made-up stories. Nothing to worry about, right? Maybe by the time our grandchildren run things, religion will have faded away. If it hasn't, I don't see much light at the end of the tunnel for the human race if religious fundamentalism stays popular and WMDs are readily accessible. That includes Christianity.

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I never once said I was a Christian. I believe in an all-powerful God/Creator. I study all sorts of different viewpoints, including athiesm, agnostic thought, other religions, etc. Just because one believes in God does not mean they don't have the time to learn, help, study, think. I CHOOSE to believe in God. I am not forced. I listen to all debates and opinions.

And this might sound overly dramatic, but if I'm killed for what I believe, I'm not angry about my beliefs not being true. I then know that my own soul was good, and I was strong in being me.

Laslty, logic points to there being some sort of intelligent design.

[Aytumious]

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Laslty, logic points to there being some sort of intelligent design.

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Please elaborate.

[KenProspero]

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Anyways, that really doesn't say anything. One of OP's points was that miracles happened a lot years ago, and we see none now.

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A 'believer' will see miracles in natural occurences, a 'non-believer' would not see a miracle under any circumstances.

So, who says that Miracles do (or don't) occur today.

I can assume with great confidence you're an intelligent person. Therefore, you're telling me that you may think that this universe we live in "just happened?" I know that may not be eloquent enough to be a credible question, but forgive me for not having the same kind of abilities as a lot of the people on here do. People speak of the Big Bang as being the starter of it all. But what created the atoms and different necessities for the Big Bang to even occur? What put it ALL in motion? There will never be a factual answer to this question, but I believe it only makes sense, LOGICALLY, that there was/is an intelligent designer.

Lastly, I leave you with my favorite C.S. Lewis line, being from Til We Have Faces: "Now I know, Lord, why you do not answer. You are the answer."

[Aytumious]

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I can assume with great confidence you're an intelligent person. Therefore, you're telling me that you may think that this universe we live in "just happened?" I know that may not be eloquent enough to be a credible question, but forgive me for not having the same kind of abilities as a lot of the people on here do. People speak of the Big Bang as being the starter of it all. But what created the atoms and different necessities for the Big Bang to even occur? What put it ALL in motion? There will never be a factual answer to this question, but I believe it only makes sense, LOGICALLY, that there was/is an intelligent designer.

Lastly, I leave you with my favorite C.S. Lewis line, being from Til We Have Faces: "Now I know, Lord, why you do not answer. You are the answer."

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What created the designer? If you answer that he doesn't need to have been created, why cannot that same logic be applied to the universe itself?

[DougShrapnel]

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What created the designer? If you answer that he doesn't need to have been created, why cannot that same logic be applied to the universe itself?

[/ QUOTE ] When you apply laws of this world to things that exist outside of it you are likey to arrive at an unfounded conclusion. The question about the universe and the logic that applies to it has the "known" consequense that the universe doesn't appear to be static. I think this arguement goes to theists.

[Aytumious]

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What created the designer? If you answer that he doesn't need to have been created, why cannot that same logic be applied to the universe itself?

[/ QUOTE ] When you apply laws of this world to things that exist outside of it you are likey to arrive at an unfounded conclusion. The question about the universe and the logic that applies to it has the "known" consequense that the universe doesn't appear to be static. I think this arguement goes to theists.

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I can't say I entirely understand what you are arguing here.