AP club just got busted

[Gandor]

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The real question that I believe has a lot of merit is why the players lose the right to their money just because the house is taking an illegal drop. If playing isn't illegal, why should you have to forfeit your money?

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It's because at the time of the raid, you do not have ownership of the money. When you sit down at the table, you give your money to the house.

[TakeMeToTheRiver]

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The real question that I believe has a lot of merit is why the players lose the right to their money just because the house is taking an illegal drop. If playing isn't illegal, why should you have to forfeit your money?

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It's because at the time of the raid, you do not have ownership of the money. When you sit down at the table, you give your money to the house.

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But you do have ownership of the chips... in many other criminal law situations, if a police officer is going to take your property, he is required to provide you with a receipt or voucher for that property. It would be interesting if a player asserted ownership interest in the chips in front of him and asked the police for a voucher. You can then try to go to court and assert that a portion of the confiscated cash (equal to the value of your chips) is yours...

But do you want to piss off the cops and might they arrest you for possession of a gambling device? I can think of other potential problems with trying this manuever, but it would be interesting if someone with a large stack tried to do this...

[Gandor]

You're right about the gambling device issue there. But those chips do not have value outside the club. I can't see a court ruling in the player's favor here.

[TakeMeToTheRiver]

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You're right about the gambling device issue there. But those chips do not have value outside the club. I can't see a court ruling in the player's favor here.

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There is plenty of evidence that the chips represent dollar amounts and a contract between the establishment (poker room) and the player that the chips had value. Obviously the chips don't have value, but the chips do give you a clear and unambiguous (although not necessarily legally enforceable) claim to a portion of the confiscated money.

[seeker]

I doubt that you "own" the chips in front of you. In Nevada, and, I believe, Atlantic City, the regulations clearly state that the chips are gambling devices owned by the casinos. They act as an IOU's, but they are not sold to the gamblers, they are given as markers. Technically, they remain the property of the casinos. Although they is no such regulation governing "illegal" card clubs in New York, I am sure the courts would look to the rules governing legal casinos and card clubs for guidance. JMHO.

[dark_horse]

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I doubt that you "own" the chips in front of you. In Nevada, and, I believe, Atlantic City, the regulations clearly state that the chips are gambling devices owned by the casinos. They act as an IOU's, but they are not sold to the gamblers, they are given as markers. Technically, they remain the property of the casinos. Although they is no such regulation governing "illegal" card clubs in New York, I am sure the courts would look to the rules governing legal casinos and card clubs for guidance. JMHO.

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Then why in Foxwoods is there a sign at the cage that reads "chip sales?"

[seeker]

I don't know. Could be they do things differently. Could be an incorrect sign. Obviously, they don't have to follow the rules set forth for Nevada and AC.