Five tools in limit Hold'em....rate them 1-5

[mtdoak]

Hand Reading

Mathmatical Knowledge

Using Position (both relative and absolute)

Adjusting to Game conditions (i.e. playing optimally for your table)

Emotional Control (keeping your play optimal under bad beats/good runs)


My thoughts:
5. Emotional control: in most cases, running tilty can usually be corrected within a session. But, emotional control is really dependent on the person. If you piss away 30 BB every time you get runner runner'd, well, this is a much bigger issue.
4. Hand reading. Being able to construct what a player has from his actions is a powerful tool, but really only an estimating tool.
3. Adjusting to game conditions. Being able to adjust your game properly to game conditions is a hallmark of a good player.
2. Mathmatical knowledge: An essential piece, esp being able to compute correct odds on the fly. However, this does not give you a decided edge over good players (but a massive one over bad ones)
1. Position. Knowing how and when to use it, combined with the other skills here, IMHO, is undoubtedly the most powerful tool in limit hold'em.

[blackize]

Not reading your thoughts yet so I dont influence my decision.

1. Adjusting to game conditions: You can't win without doing it. I think it is the most under rated skill in all of poker
2. Using Position: BIG deal
3. Emotional Control: For me this is big, I have a bit of trouble realizing when I am on tilt.
4. Hand Reading: It is very tough to win against players who arent brain dead without it
5. Mathematical knowledge: It's important, but too many situations are obvious even without knowledge of the odds

[NMcNasty]

5. Adjusting to game conditions: I think this might be overrated. For example at a table with bad players you can loosen up and play AJo and maybe ATo from early position, but no matter the game you still can't go as low as A9o. Its not that much of a difference.

4. Hand Reading: players that are bad have a wide range of garbage hands they could be playing so its difficult to get a read. Players that are good are on a smaller range of hands but are usually smart enough to mix up their play so you still can't get a decent read.

3. Position: obviously very important

2. Mathematical knowledge: extremely important in limit

1. Emotional control: It doesn't matter how good you are at poker if you go on tilt and blow away everything you've earned. If you're on tilt you are basically disregarding all of the other four tools listed.

[blackize]

[ QUOTE ]
5. Adjusting to game conditions: I think this might be overrated. For example at a table with bad players you can loosen up and play AJo and maybe ATo from early position, but no matter the game you still can't go as low as A9o. Its not that much of a difference.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well it really does depend on the game. I mainly play shorthanded and that gets me adapting to game conditions much more so than at a full ring game.

[ QUOTE ]
4. Hand Reading: players that are bad have a wide range of garbage hands they could be playing so its difficult to get a read. Players that are good are on a smaller range of hands but are usually smart enough to mix up their play so you still can't get a decent read.


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You can still get reads on the bad players by their betting patterns, and same with the better players. Very good players are very tough to read, but it is possible.

[Pog0]

1. Mathematical knowledge.
2. Position. Some of this is covered in mathematical knowledge, esp. preflop.
3. Hand knowledge, although some of this is covered in mathematical knowledge.
4. Adjusting to game conditions.

Emotional control shouldn't be on the list. It's not a tool, it's just the absence of a big and pointless leak that's not really related to the game but rather your personality.

[blackize]

EVERYONE has to deal with their emotions at the table. Some people are naturally averse to tilt, but most have to work to stay cool while playing.

I think they build on each other.
1. Mathmatical Knowledge - without the basics, you will never succeed at poker.
2. Emotional Control - a clear head will prepare you for making good decisions as often as possible.
3. (not on your list) Book Smarts / Hand Review - the ability to step back from the game and learn strategy is essential for maximizing your ability to utilize the remainder of the tools.
4. Adjusting to game conditions / knowing when to leave the game - keeping yourself in profitable situations ensures that you make good decisions and profit from those decisions
5. Using Position / Hand Reading - It's a tie for these last skills that should be added to your repertoire. These are most effective when applied together.

[D.H.]

[ QUOTE ]
Well it really does depend on the game. I mainly play shorthanded...

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This is an important factor. The lists of full-ring players will have mathematical skills high up and the lists of shorthanded players will have hand reading and adjusting to game conditions high up.

Emotional control and position is of course very important in both.

[POKhER]

*GRUNCHED*

1, Hand Reading
2, Using Position (both relative and absolute)
3, Adjusting to Game conditions (i.e. playing optimally for your table)
4, Emotional Control (keeping your play optimal under bad beats/good runs)
5, Mathmatical Knowledge


Hand reading - Knowing what the op has is SOOO VITAL.

Postion, As its the next best thign to hand selection its great to abuse.

Adjusting to games - You can win if you "adjust" i.e. loosen up or tighten up. If you play your standard game i reckon you can win any many conditions.

Mathmatical knowledge - Adding/Subtracting/Division is basic... The EV and the outs etc gets more advanced but its hardly Alevel is it.

Emotional control - Losing and tilting is bad, I vote this accordingly.

[BillFranklin]

1. Mathmatical Knowledge- Essential for limit holdem.

2. Emotional Control (keeping your play optimal under bad beats/good runs)- This is so important for playing limit where there is often a high variance.

3. Using Position (both relative and absolute). Important in any limit.

4. Adjusting to Game conditions (i.e. playing optimally
for your table)

5. Hand Reading- Don't think this is as important in limit (in particular low limit) since your basically playing your own hand opposed to no limit where your playing your opponents hand.