ATs and getting stuck with the lead

tyler_cracker · #1 10-11-2005, 08:17 PM

Villain (MP3) is 35/0/0.59 after 34 hands.

Hero probably seemed a little LAGgy to most of the table, and was hitting silly flush draws on the river a lot.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP1 calls, Hero raises, MP3 calls, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls.

Flop: (13.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, MP1 checks, Hero bets, MP3 raises, CO calls, BB calls, UTG folds, MP1 folds, Hero 3-bets, MP3 calls, CO caps, BB calls, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (14.75 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, MP3 calls, CO calls, BB folds.

River: (17.75 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, MP3 calls, CO folds.

Final Pot: 19.75 BB

I debated the flop 3-bet for some time before ultimately making it. In retrospect, i think it was spewage since the raiser was pretty passive, but with my BDFD and two others in the pot, maybe it's okay? I didn't really worry about the flop cap, as it probably came from someone with a flush draw.

After all that, i felt sort of lost because i was stuck OOP. I didn't want to check the turn and give free cards on this draw heavy board (and i would fold if Villain raised again). I didn't want to check the river because i figured better hands would bet and weaker hands would check.

How'd i do?

lautzutao · #2 10-11-2005, 08:23 PM

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since the raiser was pretty passive

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I think this statement would answer the question. You're probably being reraised by AJ AQ and they became afraid of AK or 2-pair, and decided to call down when you bet into CO on the turn.

EDIT- man I edit too much...I think the fact that others are in the pot lessens the mistake because they're padding the pot for you, but I think it's a mistake nonetheless against a passive player.

aargh57 · #3 10-11-2005, 08:36 PM

I kind of like how you played it. I almost cheated and looked at lautzutao's answer before I posted but then I decided to think it through.

On the flop I like the 3-bet. I don't think you can read too much into the AF with only 34 hands. He's only entered the pot with 12 hands so even though his AF is low it doesn't necessarily mean much. Although a better line may have been to call and then bet the turn if a blank came.

I like the turn bet for the reason that you said (not giving free cards plus you may have the best hand).

I think it's better to bet out on the river as you are going to call a bet anyway.

Now I'll go look.

tyler_cracker · #4 10-11-2005, 08:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
since the raiser was pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this statement would answer the question. You're probably being reraised by AJ AQ and they became afraid of AK or 2-pair, and decided to call down when you bet into CO on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

I should probably clarify that my "read" was exactly what PT gave me and was only over 34 hands. I hadn't been paying attention to this guy except that he expressed interest in the new Depeche Mode album me and my buddy were talking about.

So if we're just calling the flop raise, what's our plan for the rest of the hand now?

aargh57 · #5 10-11-2005, 08:42 PM

I think at the point he was raised you have to put him on a much wider range. I would say AJ, AQ, or AK are possibilities but Ax hands are also good possibilities as well as hands like 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], flush, and straight draws. I don't think this is a big enough sample to put too much weight on whether villain is that passive. When he caps, I think you have to give him more credit but when he just raises I don't think that you should narrow it down that much.

aargh57 · #6 10-11-2005, 08:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
since the raiser was pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this statement would answer the question. You're probably being reraised by AJ AQ and they became afraid of AK or 2-pair, and decided to call down when you bet into CO on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]
I hadn't been paying attention to this guy except that he expressed interest in the new Depeche Mode album me and my buddy were talking about.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's a complete maniac.

tyler_cracker · #7 10-11-2005, 08:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I hadn't been paying attention to this guy except that he expressed interest in the new Depeche Mode album me and my buddy were talking about.

[/ QUOTE ]

He's a complete maniac.

[/ QUOTE ]

At the very least, he was my personal jesus.

lautzutao · #8 10-11-2005, 08:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
since the raiser was pretty passive

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this statement would answer the question. You're probably being reraised by AJ AQ and they became afraid of AK or 2-pair, and decided to call down when you bet into CO on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

I should probably clarify that my "read" was exactly what PT gave me and was only over 34 hands. I hadn't been paying attention to this guy except that he expressed interest in the new Depeche Mode album me and my buddy were talking about.

So if we're just calling the flop raise, what's our plan for the rest of the hand now?

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha, the plan should have been to pay attention to the first 12 hands villian played then

I dunno. Your hand isn't really strong enough here IMO to 3-bet. With that draw in there I don't think you "own" 25% of this pot. So I woulda just called. (That's probably result-oriented thinking, you didn't know CO was on a possible draw until the Cap-raise came).

Buckmulligan · #9 10-11-2005, 09:00 PM

Verus a passive villain, I think I call down after he caps the flop. Since he didn't raise you on the turn though, I like the river bet.

tyler_cracker · #10 10-11-2005, 09:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Verus a passive villain, I think I call down after he caps the flop. Since he didn't raise you on the turn though, I like the river bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

The flop capper was not Villain; it was CO.

If Villain had capped, i would have check/folded this particular turn.