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#121
10-07-2005, 07:50 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'd like to hear his response to this. [/ QUOTE ] My language may sometimes be extreme - to emphasize a point. But RJT has me nailed - pretty good for a Romish type. [/ QUOTE ] Well, if that is what you truly believe than it sounds like you are admitting that meaning can exist in a world without God and most of our debates have been more of a waste of time than I originally thought. 
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#122
10-07-2005, 07:54 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
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[ QUOTE ] Also, I understand him to be saying meaning cannot arise from chance [/ QUOTE ] Finally. Now I can retire. [/ QUOTE ] and you're talking about any meaning at all aren't you? Not just some absolute meaning. chez
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#123
10-07-2005, 07:56 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'd like to hear his response to this. [/ QUOTE ] My language may sometimes be extreme - to emphasize a point. But RJT has me nailed - pretty good for a Romish type. [/ QUOTE ] Not ony Roman (Church), but Italian descent (southern Italy actually.)
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#124
10-07-2005, 07:59 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I'd like to hear his response to this. [/ QUOTE ] My language may sometimes be extreme - to emphasize a point. But RJT has me nailed - pretty good for a Romish type. [/ QUOTE ] Not ony Roman (Church), but Italian descent (southern Italy actually.) [/ QUOTE ] whereabouts? She who sleeps at night is from Calabria chez
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#125
10-07-2005, 08:18 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I'd like to hear his response to this. [/ QUOTE ] My language may sometimes be extreme - to emphasize a point. But RJT has me nailed - pretty good for a Romish type. [/ QUOTE ] Not ony Roman (Church), but Italian descent (southern Italy actually.) [/ QUOTE ] whereabouts? She who sleeps at night is from Calabria chez [/ QUOTE ] 3/4 Basilicata, right next to Calabria (the instep of the Italian "boot") , 1/4 Sicilian. RJT
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#126
10-07-2005, 08:46 PM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'd like to hear his response to this. [/ QUOTE ] My language may sometimes be extreme - to emphasize a point. But RJT has me nailed - pretty good for a Romish type. [/ QUOTE ] Ironic how a fellow believer points out what you "really" mean and you go right with it. So you're basically admitting that your extreme position about absolute meaning in all these threads was just you being stubborn. Very well.
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#127
10-08-2005, 12:20 AM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
and you're talking about any meaning at all aren't you? Not just some absolute meaning. [/ QUOTE ] A fundamental difficulty I have here is discussing something theoretical with the assumption that God doesn't exist. I do it to demonstrate the internal lack of coherence in the any non-theistic system, but to discuss it in actualities becomes meaningless to me. For me to say there would be meaning of any kind without God would be to assume the logically impossible. I think people have meaning (relative) in their lives because God exists, whether they admit it or not, because they have life at all, knowledge at all, something to know at all, because God exists. So someone can have meaning (relative) in their lives while denying the existence of God (which sets up the tension that is most pronounced in modern man and labelled angst), but to say they could have meaning in their lives if God didn't actually exist is beyond my knowledge because I believe it's impossible for God not to exist.
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#128
10-08-2005, 12:25 AM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
Well, if that is what you truly believe than it sounds like you are admitting that meaning can exist in a world without God and most of our debates have been more of a waste of time than I originally thought [/ QUOTE ] I just posted a response to chez which addresses this. In a nutshell I don't believe meaning can exist in a world without God because I think that it's impossible for God not to exist. I believe someone who doesn't believe in God still has relative meaning in their life because God created them and created the meaning they have. I suppose I could say that if God doesn't exist what you see is what you get - you could then go the N. route and make your own meaning, but it would be ultimately futile, a kind of cosmic joke, and completely meaningless in the end.
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#129
10-08-2005, 01:23 AM
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Re: Herr Little Freddie Nietzche
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] and you're talking about any meaning at all aren't you? Not just some absolute meaning. [/ QUOTE ] A fundamental difficulty I have here is discussing something theoretical with the assumption that God doesn't exist. I do it to demonstrate the internal lack of coherence in the any non-theistic system, but to discuss it in actualities becomes meaningless to me. For me to say there would be meaning of any kind without God would be to assume the logically impossible. I think people have meaning (relative) in their lives because God exists, whether they admit it or not, because they have life at all, knowledge at all, something to know at all, because God exists. So someone can have meaning (relative) in their lives while denying the existence of God (which sets up the tension that is most pronounced in modern man and labelled angst), but to say they could have meaning in their lives if God didn't actually exist is beyond my knowledge because I believe it's impossible for God not to exist. [/ QUOTE ] Could you remind be again why you believe it's impossible for god not to exist. (Sorry, I could trawl through all the threads but I might not live that long [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) chez
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#130
10-08-2005, 05:30 AM
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Re: A Compromise about ID in Biology Classes
umm...i dont get what exactly it is that is so hard to understand. Evolutionary theory, is based primarily off of natural selection, and other small variables such as genetic drift and gene flow but those we wont discuss. Natural selection, IS tested, HAS BEEN proven, and is proven EVERY SINGLE DAY...natural selection is the reason antibiotics fail to work after a given amount of time. The disease has EVOLVED and the medicine doesn't work. The same laws apply to basically everything. Creationism, in my opinion, has to be a joke. Anyone beliving in it, obviously doesn't think for themselves and only repeats what theyve been told by others, which is fine because they dont know any better. Im not patronizing either, it really is okay its not their fault. But the argument is simple, evolution is a fact now, not an idea. The only remaining question is what started the very first organism.
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