This hand is on trial for crimes against decency

[callydrias]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm ready to fold the flop basically because I shouldn't have called preflop. Vs. the SB's likely range, I don't love where I'm at given that I didn't flop a straight or a boat [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

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Given that there are 3 limpers in the pot who aren't very good, I think you can expand SB's range to include anything that plays well multiway and especially against people who will fish, which includes lots of suited connectors and one-gappers. So given the expanded range and your immediate odds, I think the preflop call is fine.

I like the whole line, especially the turn raise. If SB is the only caller on the turn, I take a free showdown if checked to (probably fold to a donk). In this case, where Button is the only caller, I like bet/fold on the river, but I don't think check/calling is bad.

[PokerNoob]

The bet is only good if he'll call King worse kicker, but since you're going to call anyway, you might as well bet. OTOH, if he's really passive or incapable of bluffing, there's nothing wrong with the free showdown. On the third hand, you played this because the opponents are loose chasing fish, so lets see that king worse kicker, TT, whatever he'll call.

[aslowjoe]

I am tighter them most pre flop but I think getting 9-1 on your call against bad players s just fine. Now I guess this is the exact flop you do not want to see. I agree with whole line of reasoning on the hand. You bet the river because SB will call for 1 more with his QQ and bttn will call with his 88 or raise with his 66 which you could fold too. Well played.

[ddubois]

Button's play is consistent with a turned flush draw, so checking to induce a bluff isn't unreasonable.

[joker122]

pretty much the only hands that call 2 on the turn are a club draw or a diamon draw or an ace. so i check call the river.

[ QUOTE ]
Is there any street that we don't hate?

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Yeah. Good check on the flop. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]


Seriously though, folding preflop with everyone left behind you isn't as bad as it seems. The SB is the last guy you want to mix it up with and he showed tremendous strength by raising the field from his position.

The turn raise is very questionable, but you got lucky. It makes no sense to say "he would have bet the flop with an ace", simply because he cannot have just 'an ace' considering his preflop play. He either has AK, AA, KK or QQ. He's a favorite not to have QQ, but you got lucky on the turn in that aspect.

Once the button calls 2 cold on the turn you should c/c the river. A bet accomplishes nothing but getting him to fold a draw or getting him to call with an ace or better. Check/calling may pick off a bluff, and if it checks through, you usually win.

[B Dids]

I'm well aware that he could have AA or KK, I'm insta folding to a raise. But if he doesn't, I get to win the pot right there a lot, which was the attempt.

[TwoNiner]

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I feel like I have to bet/fold here given the pot that I've now bloated.

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Nah, that's why it's definitely a check-call. You don't want to be bluffed off this pot given the likelyhood of a busted flush draw. You want to induce the bluff and grab the extra bet. Or you want a better hand to maybe check behind saving a bet, which is also a definite possibility given your turn raise.

Preflop: is a fold. Huge possibility of Big Pair or Ace-King, and your trapped with bad relative position in a big field with a hand that will hit mediocre hands.

[tansoku]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Is there any street that we don't hate?

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Yeah. Good check on the flop. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]



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If you lead the flop, and the other weak players come along, it gives SB a great chance to chk-raise and trap everyone for another bet.
Seems like it gives you a way to define his hand, and only costs you 1 SB to find out.
I guess it comes down to whether you think he'd chk-raise with a hand you are ahead of.
Is a flop lead really that bad?

[Drontier]

i fold hands better than this if its 3 bet to me on the bb. easy fold.