10-20 colluders

[sublime]

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Posting people's screen names here is merely bad etiquette. Accusing them of collusion could get you sued.

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If they're in the US, I'm not sure how that would work. Accusing someone of cheating in an "illegal" game can't really be slander, as the penalties the cheaters would take for whatever the Justice Department decides to throw at them would be infinitely worse than the few bucks the OP would have to pay them.

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apparently you have never heard of the "internet laws act of '01" and the court of virtual justice of the matrix which enforces them.

noob

[TimWillTell]

This is no proof at all.
Many players especially at the higher limits will try seemingly stupit raises on turn and river, and why? To kick the winner out!
If this fails, yes then they give up.
If they where colluding, why then not create a hugh pot when one of them had AA. They didn't do that.
What I need to see: all the hands they play, also the ones when they are not both in the hand. Better mail Party and leave it up to them, they have the tools to make a good judgement.
Much better then possibly wrongly accusing players.

[elmo]

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** Dealing Flop ** [ 5h, Td, 8d ]
GTI_43 checks.
I_RAIZE_U checks.
Miro41 bets [$10].
Pikealot calls [$10].
GTI_43 raises [$20].
I_RAIZE_U folds.
Miro41 calls [$10].
Pikealot calls [$10].
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jc ]

GTI_43 shows [ Ts, Qd ] a pair of tens.
Miro41 doesn't show [ Kc, 8c ] a pair of eights.

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I'm not a collusion expert, but a raise by GTI followed by a call by Miro with someone to act behind seems dumb. They have middle and bottom pairs, respectively. Wouldn't a three-bet make more sense?

This could be collusion, but they could also both suck, and be playing back at each other like donkeys. If my colluding opponents want to put 2 bet each in on the turn with 1 pair decent kicker, I welcome their action.

[StellarWind]

GTI_43 is a typical 69/10 donkey who takes a lot of shots.

Your evidence is pretty weak to put it mildly. Many of your hands look remarkably normal.

You should be ashamed of yourself for accusing players of collusion by name in a public forum with so little evidence.

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If they're in the US, I'm not sure how that would work.

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Unfortunately, in the US, lawsuits work only too well.

[Pike]

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GTI_43 is a typical 69/10 donkey who takes a lot of shots.

Your evidence is pretty weak to put it mildly. Many of your hands look remarkably normal.


You should be ashamed of yourself for accusing players of collusion by name in a public forum with so little evidence.

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Another thing was that they had vpip's of 70 and 80 yet the only times they folded preflop they both folded. They both entered the tables at approximately the same time and both left the tables at approximately the same time. I think its ridiculous that anyone would even doubt that they're colluding considering the evidence. Anyone who thinks these hands look remarkably normal has to be fooling themselves.

And of final note, its not that I'm ACCUSING these players of being cheaters. They obviously are, end of point. I'm just exposing them so those of you who might enter a game where these two are, won't be swindled.

Let's give a real life example so you understand my point:

Let's say you own a convienent store and you get robbed. The two people who robbed you are two people in your community whose names you know. The cops [party's customer service in this case] are quite frankly terrible and won't do anything about the situation. So instead you tell all the other convienent store owner's [other poker players who play the 10-20 game] that these two idiots are robbers and to watch out for them.

So I should be ashamed for telling honest poker players to watch out for a scam two idiots are pulling???

[TimWillTell]

please inform Party and post their reply.

[vilemerchant]

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Another thing was that they had vpip's of 70 and 80 yet the only times they folded preflop they both folded. They both entered the tables at approximately the same time and both left the tables at approximately the same time.


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Why on earth would you want players who are putting that kind of dead money into nearly every pot to be banned? Are you allergic to money?

[Timer]

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Another thing was that they had vpip's of 70 and 80 yet the only times they folded preflop they both folded. They both entered the tables at approximately the same time and both left the tables at approximately the same time. I think its ridiculous that anyone would even doubt that they're colluding considering the evidence. Anyone who thinks these hands look remarkably normal has to be fooling themselves.

And of final note, its not that I'm ACCUSING these players of being cheaters. They obviously are, end of point. I'm just exposing them so those of you who might enter a game where these two are, won't be swindled.

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Let's say for the sake of argument that they are cheaters. So what? You want horrible cheaters in your game. But you have no idea if they're cheaters or not. A couple of hands doesn't prove anything. There are much more important areas to worry about as far as cheating is concerned. Two donks who might or might not be cheating isn't one of them.

One other thing: you wouldn't be able to spot professional cheating if you were told who they were.

[Pike]

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Let's say for the sake of argument that they are cheaters. So what? You want horrible cheaters in your game. But you have no idea if they're cheaters or not. A couple of hands doesn't prove anything. There are much more important areas to worry about as far as cheating is concerned. Two donks who might or might not be cheating isn't one of them.

One other thing: you wouldn't be able to spot professional cheating if you were told who they were.

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Well I'll give you that the way they were cheating was obvious and horrible. It was basically if they wanted you out of the pot they'd bet and raise if they wanted you out of the pot, and if they wanted you in the pot they'd bet into you trapping you in and then have the guy on the otherside of you raise. So if you were aware of this you could make a bunch of money. But if you were say 4 tabling and didn't notice these things you'd probably be laying down a number of winning hands.

And the difference with professional cheating would be that they'd do it a lot more subtly and slowly. These 2 just did a 30 minute hit and run job that netted them quite a big win. So true professionals would theoretically be a bigger problem because they'd be able to last longer without being caught, but these 2 guys will probably net more on a per hour basis just because they don't care about concealing the fact that they're cheating.

It's not like it's only a few hands either, I just picked 5 or 6 because I didn't want to post 50 hands. If you'd like me to post every hand I would, but I assume no one wants me to do that.