5/10 6m A8s against a 2+2er

[jason_t]

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You think so? BB might defend with any broadway here. That gives him 4 outs to a straight. He's not calling a turn bet with KT or QT.

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Doesn't 4 outs still put villain WB? I'm never sure how many outs is the "cutoff" point to use this line.

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It's not the number of outs per se, it's the number of outs in relation to the size of the pot and a few other factors such as the likelihood that he'll bluff if he misses after I check or check/raise on a semibluff after I bet.

[Womble]

I take it the only reason you check this turn is because villain is a good player that would fold alot of hands to a turn bet. I would never have seen this, obviously have a way to go

However with standard $1/2 players that call alot, you would bet/bet/bet unless a read told you otherwise?

[numeri]

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You think so? BB might defend with any broadway here. That gives him 4 outs to a straight. He's not calling a turn bet with KT or QT.

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Doesn't 4 outs still put villain WB? I'm never sure how many outs is the "cutoff" point to use this line.

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It's not the number of outs per se, it's the number of outs in relation to the size of the pot and a few other factors such as the likelihood that he'll bluff if he misses after I check or check/raise on a semibluff after I bet.

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Very helpful. Thanks.

[Raza]

I played a hand yesterday that's similar I think:

I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] UTG+1, suspected 2+2er 3bets, folded around, I cap.

Flop: Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Bet, call.
Turn: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.
River: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.

The difference was I was out of position, but I figured he could reasonably put me on AK and bet plenty of lower pairs (KK, JJ, TT), or try to push me off big cards with AK, or AJ even (which I had seen him do before against yet another 2+2er at the table).

Did I get this one right?

[Entity]

[ QUOTE ]
I played a hand yesterday that's similar I think:

I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] UTG+1, suspected 2+2er 3bets, folded around, I cap.

Flop: Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Bet, call.
Turn: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.
River: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.

The difference was I was out of position, but I figured he could reasonably put me on AK and bet plenty of lower pairs (KK, JJ, TT), or try to push me off big cards with AK, or AJ even (which I had seen him do before against yet another 2+2er at the table).

Did I get this one right?

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A river checkraise-fold-to-3bet would be a really interesting play here. I don't think you'll get 3-bet by JJ here but I think any PP (TT & JJ) and possibly AK, AJs, may pay you off.

Rob

[jason_t]

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However with standard $1/2 players that call alot, you would bet/bet/bet unless a read told you otherwise?

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Yes.

[private joker]

[ QUOTE ]
I played a hand yesterday that's similar I think:

I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] UTG+1, suspected 2+2er 3bets, folded around, I cap.

Flop: Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Bet, call.
Turn: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.
River: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.



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I wonder if it might be right to checkraise the river. It's doubtful he has a Q unless he has AQ, but it's more likely he has a worse PP like KK, JJ, TT. He'll pay off a checkraise almost every time.

EDIT: I just saw Entity's post. Oops.

[Raza]

That's a nice catch by both of you. I thought about it at the time, but wussed out before thinking it through.

[istewart]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I played a hand yesterday that's similar I think:

I raise A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] UTG+1, suspected 2+2er 3bets, folded around, I cap.

Flop: Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Bet, call.
Turn: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.
River: 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Check, bet, call.

The difference was I was out of position, but I figured he could reasonably put me on AK and bet plenty of lower pairs (KK, JJ, TT), or try to push me off big cards with AK, or AJ even (which I had seen him do before against yet another 2+2er at the table).

Did I get this one right?

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A river checkraise-fold-to-3bet would be a really interesting play here. I don't think you'll get 3-bet by JJ here but I think any PP (TT & JJ) and possibly AK, AJs, may pay you off.

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Do you really think so if he's a 2+2er here? The line we took might confuse him a bit, I agree. And is the line that hero took here optimal?

[baronzeus]

the main thing to note is that people rarely fold A high on QQ99x board