Early in Stars nighttime 20+2

[betgo]

I think the limp is fine with the big suited gapper. I think the limp is much better than raising or folding.

However, your aim is to make a big hand. It's OK to take down a small pot with top pair.

I may be weak/tight, but I call or fold to the flop bet. When you get reraised, you may be up against a draw but you have to fold.

With KJs, you have some potential to make a big hand and take out some fish who puts all his chips in with top pair.

I would be very cautious with top pair. With 5 players, someone might have you beat. People are willing to give a lot of action and you could be ahead, but I wait for bettter opportunities.

I don't mind just calling, although in this particular situation a raise would probably be better because

a.) SB prolly is calling anything because of the pot odds
b.) BB gets to see flop for free
c.) Person who called before you didn't really show strength and might have been looking to see a cheap flop with only 4 people behind him/her (and 2 already invested)

Raise to narrow the field, then play accordingly on the flop

Now to on the flop

This flop is moderately dangerous for a couple reasons:

a.) since pot odds were big for each person, I wouldn't be surprised if someone was playing 2 suited cards or drawing to a straight
b.) With that many people in the pot it prolly hit someone

You still have Top Pair and medium kicker though so it's not time to give up on the hand, but I would definitely Fold after the bet and call was made by the 2 people infront of you..

a.) You have people behind you yet to act, why make a raise with a moderate holding?
b.) The 2 people infront of you wouldn't try to steal with so many people behind them.. they prolly have something

There's too many dangers here, you could already beaten by KQ, you also have too many people that are still live and in the pot, fold.

[dimastermind]

As I suspected, the initial bettor (BB) had 58 and the caller/shover in mp3 had 5c4c, for an open ender and a flush draw. Can anyone help calculate the odds for all 3 hands in this situation? I'm especially interested in what Hero's % to win vs. those 2 hands is.

And Yes, the river did make 58 the straight (although i will never understand why he called the 2 pushes)

I was doomed for the tourney. next hand I instapush 380 w/ AA and get 2 callers, TT and KQ. Flop ATx, turn blank, and still check check (hell of a slowplay from TT) river J, GG.

[Elaboration]

dimaster,

I dont mind the flop raise, as it helps you define your hand. That being said, MP3 would have to be getting really aggro with KT for you to be in great shape. Nevermind that BB has now bet and called your raise. There are a lot of donks in this Stars tourney, but generally, I let this go on the flop.

[grandgnu]

[ QUOTE ]
As I suspected, the initial bettor (BB) had 58 and the caller/shover in mp3 had 5c4c, for an open ender and a flush draw. Can anyone help calculate the odds for all 3 hands in this situation? I'm especially interested in what Hero's % to win vs. those 2 hands is.

And Yes, the river did make 58 the straight (although i will never understand why he called the 2 pushes)

I was doomed for the tourney. next hand I instapush 380 w/ AA and get 2 callers, TT and KQ. Flop ATx, turn blank, and still check check (hell of a slowplay from TT) river J, GG.

[/ QUOTE ]

Check out www.cardplayer.com and use their Texas Hold 'Em odds calculator.

[betgo]

Nice read.

You have a 28% chance 3-way against the two draws. Heads up, you have a 43% chance against the player with the strong draw.

These may seem like good results, but against a stronger made hand, you would be close to drawing dead.

[Koss]

[ QUOTE ]

And Yes, the river did make 58 the straight (although i will never understand why he called the 2 pushes)


[/ QUOTE ]

Typical fish play is to never fold an OESD or flush draw regardless of the odds, action in front of them, or the likelihood that some of their outs are no good. All you can do is take some comfort in the fact that these will be the people you'll do most of your stack building from early on when they call down your pot sized bets with some relatively weak draws.

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
Typical fish play is to never fold an OESD or flush draw regardless of the odds, action in front of them, or the likelihood that some of their outs are no good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Typical fish play is to never fold top pair, regardless of their kicker, the odds, and action in front of them.

[Koss]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Typical fish play is to never fold an OESD or flush draw regardless of the odds, action in front of them, or the likelihood that some of their outs are no good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Typical fish play is to never fold top pair, regardless of their kicker, the odds, and action in front of them.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL, also very true. Reminds me of a hand I saw early in a $5 tourney. 4 players limp see a king high flop with 2 other rags. Ther were 2 hearts on the board. The betting just explodes. Someone leads out, and it's followed by a series of raises that ends up with all 4 players all in. It's KQ vs. 3 flush draws. One of the flush draws ends up catching a backdoor straight to win it. I was trying to put some of the guys on hands when the all the raising was going on, then laughed when the cards were turned over.

[dimastermind]

Hurts [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] obv next time put in the situation I plan to call the flop and reevaluate the turn. I'm pretty sure had I done that here I would have taken down a good pot on the turn.