QQ Against a Super-Passive

W. Deranged · #1 09-01-2005, 01:09 AM

This hand struck me as kind of interesting.

Key in this hand is that SB has only raised 1 of 80 hands he's played pre-flop. His stats are like 32/1/1.5 or something like that. Comments about sample size are welcomed.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, MP3 calls, 2 folds, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, UTG calls, Hero caps, MP3 calls, SB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (17 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets, UTG folds, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (10 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, MP3 calls, SB calls.

River: (16 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, MP3 folds.

Against standard players I liked my line quite a bit. I'm interested in what people think of this line against standard opponents and against the super-passive opponent in question.

Brunger · #2 09-01-2005, 01:15 AM

I play it the same.

ejay · #3 09-01-2005, 01:17 AM

i would the same thing

WillyTrailer · #4 09-01-2005, 01:24 AM

Why raise this turn? I could understand it if the pot were a little bit smaller, but not here. You're most likely drawing and you have a good draw at that. You can't protect your draw by raising because a flush draw is going nowhere. You're behind and need to improve to win so I call. On the river is where I time out at my other tables because I stare at the screen thinking about how I really should fold.

-WT

Stinkybeaver · #5 09-01-2005, 01:29 AM

I'm raising the flop here as my standard line but I guess the passiveness of this player could alternate tha decission. But I just don't see what we get from calling down..? WA/WB line..? I thought this line was best when HU.

WillyTrailer · #6 09-01-2005, 01:29 AM

I responded too quickly...let me rethink this.

-WT

TheHip41 · #7 09-01-2005, 01:35 AM

I call every street. If he's got AA, good for him. If he decided to get retarded with AJ, good for you.

If you opponent weren't passive, then a raise is better.

W. Deranged · #8 09-01-2005, 01:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I call every street. If he's got AA, good for him. If he decided to get retarded with AJ, good for you.

If you opponent weren't passive, then a raise is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm calling all the way down in a heads-up pot.

Since it's three-handed I feel that I have to get a raise in somewhere on the early streets to charge the third player who is likely drawing. I think the presence of the third player pushes this to a "raise the turn and hope the hell to get a free showdown unimproved."

The problem is that my desire to not pay too much when drawing is in strong conflict with my desire to charge the third player for his draw and to prevent him from drawing out cheaply if he has overcards or something.

TheHip41 · #9 09-01-2005, 01:52 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I call every street. If he's got AA, good for him. If he decided to get retarded with AJ, good for you.

If you opponent weren't passive, then a raise is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm calling all the way down in a heads-up pot.

Since it's three-handed I feel that I have to get a raise in somewhere on the early streets to charge the third player who is likely drawing. I think the presence of the third player pushes this to a "raise the turn and hope the hell to get a free showdown unimproved."

The problem is that my desire to not pay too much when drawing is in strong conflict with my desire to charge the third player for his draw and to prevent him from drawing out cheaply if he has overcards or something.

[/ QUOTE ]

I completely understand about the third player, but, in the process of getting rid of him, you might get 3 bet, which would suck since you cant fold.

WillyTrailer · #10 09-01-2005, 01:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I call every street. If he's got AA, good for him. If he decided to get retarded with AJ, good for you.

If you opponent weren't passive, then a raise is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm calling all the way down in a heads-up pot.

Since it's three-handed I feel that I have to get a raise in somewhere on the early streets to charge the third player who is likely drawing. I think the presence of the third player pushes this to a "raise the turn and hope the hell to get a free showdown unimproved."

The problem is that my desire to not pay too much when drawing is in strong conflict with my desire to charge the third player for his draw and to prevent him from drawing out cheaply if he has overcards or something.

[/ QUOTE ]

I completely understand about the third player, but, in the process of getting rid of him, you might get 3 bet, which would suck since you cant fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Indeed, I agree. Getting three bet would suck and again you don't have enough leverage to make a flush draw fold. I still don't know if I call the river. as it is, I fold the river after the turn raise.

-WT