|
|
#141
08-22-2005, 12:54 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Re: Bush asks for sacrifice he doesn\'t ask of himself
</font><blockquote><font class="small">En réponse à:</font><hr />
I'm declaring this thread dead before it even gets started. This is about to get ugly. [/ QUOTE ] I should replace Ms. Cleo now that she's gone. I'm a friggin genius. 
|
|
#142
08-22-2005, 01:02 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
[ QUOTE ]
"Hostility toward America is a religious duty, and we hope to be rewarded for it by God... I am confident that Muslims will be able to end the legend of the so-called superpower that is America. -Osama Bin Laden" [/ QUOTE ] Anyone who feels we are not at war with terrorism is a total ass clown and should have no right to an opinion on what America should and should not do. I'll answer your first question by saying, no, I don't want to come join a small group of ass clowns. Gallup polls in the fall of 2001 following 9/11 showed that 89% of all Americans supported taking military action against the Taliban, and 75% said they would still support it even if it meant the loss of thousands of American lives. So out of that 89% of America, everyone who didn't enlist is a coward and a hypocrite? Obviously not. But, of course, now that is the case with Iraq since you disagree with the Iraq policy (and I'm sure you simply hate all Republicans). Can you see how much of an ass you are now? -Matt
|
|
#143
08-22-2005, 01:43 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
[ QUOTE ]
the blatant hypocrisy of the testosterone-fuelled bellicosity of the armchair superpatriots of this page. [/ QUOTE ] Enter PorscheNGuns...(the fact this handle is 'PorscheNGuns' makes this even more priceless): [ QUOTE ] Anyone who feels we are not at war with terrorism is a total ass clown and should have no right to an opinion on what America should and should not do. I'll answer your first question by saying, no, I don't want to come join a small group of ass clowns. Gallup polls in the fall of 2001 following 9/11 showed that 89% of all Americans supported taking military action against the Taliban, and 75% said they would still support it even if it meant the loss of thousands of American lives. So out of that 89% of America, everyone who didn't enlist is a coward and a hypocrite? Obviously not. But, of course, now that is the case with Iraq since you disagree with the Iraq policy (and I'm sure you simply hate all Republicans). Can you see how much of an ass you are now? -Matt [/ QUOTE ]
|
|
#144
08-22-2005, 02:01 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
[ QUOTE ]
Let's dissect completely your last stand. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [ QUOTE ] Your notion that a soldier in Iraq is the most essential job in America right now is not only arbitrary, but is designed to discredit anyone who supports the Iraq war but is not over there. [/ QUOTE ] Aye on the discredit part, Nay on the arbitrary part. Simple questions: 1. Your president claims that the US is at war with terrorism. Your president also claims that the war in Iraq is part of the war against terror. Do you accept your president's claims? If you don't, stop what you're doing and come join us. If you do, proceed to the next question. [/ QUOTE ] Claims accepted. [ QUOTE ] 2. War is the most critical situation a nation can find itself in, short of physical catastrophe. Do you suscribe to this notion ? If you don't, kindly explain why not and provide one example of a situation which is more critical. If you do, proceed to the next question. [/ QUOTE ] Agreed. [ QUOTE ] 3. In times of a critical situation, the most essential jobs are the ones the directly address the relevant crisis (for examples look here). Do you agree ? If you don't, you are being illogical since you are contradicting the very assumptions on which the notion of war's criticality is based. If you do, proceed to the next question. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, with some important caveats. Not everyone can perform the most essential job. Not everyone wants to perform the most essential job. We have plenty of people who do and are performing the essential job. [ QUOTE ] 4. An American who finds his fellow Americans in a critical situation, where he can help directly and essentially, but chooses instead to skip the essential (leaving others to carry it out), is a coward. Do you agree that he is a coward ? And if the situation is like Iraq, where besides everything else, he supports the war, but still does not want to fight it, then he is also a hypocrite. Do you agree that he is a hypocrite ? Which is it ? [/ QUOTE ] Obviously disagree. There is no need for his services. Cowardice would only be if his services were needed and then he declined. Not a hypocrite. I refuse to accept your argument that I have to want to serve in the military in order to hold opinions as to the validity of a war. It is a petty, spurious argument that is not based in any way on the reality that we live in where we have a standing military to specifically fight our wars. A number of people have shot your argument full of holes with a variety of counter-arguments and analogies, and you simply refuse to reason. I have a question for you. You appear to be "an American who finds his fellow Americans in a critical situation, where he can help directly and essentially, but chooses instead to skip the essential (leaving others to carry it out)." In fact, not only do you refuse to help, you are actively fighting against your fellow American's needs. Are you a coward? NCAces
|
|
#145
08-22-2005, 02:05 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Bush asks for sacrifice he doesn\'t ask of himself
If this reasoning is correct, and 9/11 et al. was all the fault of Clinton and Bush was not culpable in the slightest bit, then how do you account for the fact that Bush slashed counterterrorism funding in favor of building NMD? Sandy Berger (I know he is kinda a pos, but bracket that off) and others warned the new administration officials about terrorism, and those threats were more or less brushed off. Is it really fair to place none of the blame with this administration?
Also, you accuse Clinton of not capturing Bin Laden when he had an opportunity. Are you suggesting that there weren't any missed opportunities for Bush to have captured BL?
|
|
#146
08-22-2005, 02:05 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
[ QUOTE ]
We have plenty of people who do and are performing the essential job. [/ QUOTE ] You sure about that? Seems to be an unbelievable amount of people on this board who thinks the military is full of [censored] when they claim they need more recruits.
|
|
#147
08-22-2005, 02:13 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone who feels we are not at war with terrorism is a total ass clown and should have no right to an opinion on what America should and should not do. I'll answer your first question by saying, no, I don't want to come join a small group of ass clowns. [/ QUOTE ] Sigh, grow up. Whether it is, or is not a war is very questionable, we are at war with Iraq however. Mindless insults are the last bastion of the man who built his arguments on the sand. Mack
|
|
#148
08-22-2005, 02:18 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: As simple as it gets
PorscheNGuns,
Please refrain from name-calling. The poster should not be called an ass (although it is perfectly all right to describe his argument as asinine. Hopefully you can demonstrate satisfactorily that it is so--and in my opinion your example was a good start).
|
|
#149
08-22-2005, 02:23 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Conflict
I am anti-war but i have to say that this argument is ridicoulous. Why does 'support' mean that you have to join the army fighting the war? I 'support' anti-war campaigners in that i agree with their stance but I'm not camped outside bush's pad. Questions to OP- do you support the police in their crime fighting capacity? Are you a policeman?
|
|
#150
08-22-2005, 02:31 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Conflict
[ QUOTE ]
I am anti-war but i have to say that this argument is ridicoulous. Why does 'support' mean that you have to join the army fighting the war? I 'support' anti-war campaigners in that i agree with their stance but I'm not camped outside bush's pad. Questions to OP- do you support the police in their crime fighting capacity? Are you a policeman? [/ QUOTE ] This isn't your fault, Devilworm...but having went through three threads now with the topic of war support and hypocrisy, this will seemingly never end because of the endless stream of different posters who stumble onto the threads and end up saying the same three or four things over and over (and over and over and over) again. 1) Obviously, if you're against the war, but do nothing to prevent it, you're not 'supporting the anti-war' movement - you're just a hypocritical observer. 2) If the police were in dire need of more policemen, and you refused to become policemen, yet claimed to support crime fighting, you're just as hypocritical as someone who supports the war but refuses to fight. Sorry, Devil, but your rebuttal has more or less been brought up (and addressed) no less than 10 times. Not your fault, I know.
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
