live 1/1/2 game, lucky chances

[wutevahung]

i went to lucky chances yesterday with my friend, had fun in the 1/1/2 game, many fish, won about 700 in 5 hours but anyway, my friend and i got into an argument if he played this hand wrong, he thinks he played it right and i thought he should ve raised flop, but anyway here is the hand
my friend (had about 400 in front of him) had 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and he was the dealer, had about 3 limpers in front of him, he called and sb/bb checked.
flop came 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]jack [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]and sb bet 10dollars, bb folded, utg called and everyone folded. my friend called.
sb(200 dollars) and utg ( around 150) are two loose passive players and both my friends and i thought the 10dollars bet/call means they have a draw.
turn a jack [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], sb bet 20 and utg called, my friend made it 80, sb thought about it and said "i will gamble" and called, utg went all in for 60 more, my friend called and sb called.
river 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], sb went all in with 60 dollars more, my friend thought about it for like 1 minute and he called.

result: my friend won with pair 4, sb showed 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and utg mucked, my friend and i thought he had open ended draw.

but anyway, i thought that he should ve raised flop because he was on a strong draw, and if he doesnt improve his hand on the turn, his hand would be much weaker, so he should ve play it strongly since the opponents were weak and we should make them put more money in the pot since he flopped a monster draw, or even let his opponents throw away their top pair/mid pair, but my friends thought that his pair 4 could have easily been outdrawn and did not want to put more money in the pot because even though his opponents did not represent any strength, they could still have a jack low or a mid pair, he only raised on the turn because that is when he found out his opponents did not have the jack, so...who is right?

[rikz]

I would have folded preflop.

However, if I was going to play this, I'd raise 4x BB + 1BB/limper (say about $15 to go). Then, that flop would have been the best I could have hoped for - a pair and a flush draw, so I would have bet a little more than the pot on a continuation bet to force out higher flush draws.

After that, I'd check behind to take a free card on the turn if I'm checked to, and only call a bet if the math is right. On the river, if checked to again and I still have no improvement, then I "value" bet to try and get any other draws that might have also hit a pair higher than 4s to fold out. If I did hit my flush on the turn, then I'd bet 3/4 pot to prevent someone with just the Ah from getting a good price to see the river. And again, if no more hearts on the river, would most likely "value" bet as much as I think the villain still in the hand would call. On the other hand, if I suspected that one of the villains might have hit a higher flush than mine, I might check behind on the river to avoid a trap. If I hit on the turn on this line and someone goes all-in over the top of me, I'll probably call and expect to lose my stack every once in a while to a higher flush - if the board hadn't paired. But with a paired board, I'd fold. There is nothing worse than drawing to a flush on a paired board because the biggest action you get is from a full house just waiting for that 3rd heart to hit.

Finally, if I hit on the river after taking a free card on the turn, I certainly call any reasonable bet ahead of me, but I might very well check behind if it's check to me. It was probably obvious that I took a free card on the turn, so it's likely that the only hand that calls a good river bet with a 3rd heart on the river is one that beats me with a higher flush or a full house trying to trap me. I also might fold to a push from a tight player who had been slow playing all previous streets if I strongly suspect he has the boat.