Random thoughts about going super pro (long)

[adanthar]

Two things to consider, one good and one bad.

Good: As a teacher, you don't have the resume problem that other people have mentioned, at all. When in need, you can simply say you took a few years off to write a novel that didn't pan out (or, for that matter, you can actually write one.) Every other teacher on the planet has already tried this; you can, too.

Bad: I remember you mentioning you are from Mexico. If you are not a citizen yet and only have a green card or a work visa, you can potentially get into some pretty bad legal trouble (specifically, deportation proceedings) depending on how the government decides to treat online poker in the next few years. Talk to a lawyer *and* an accountant about this to maximize your cover (if you're a citizen, you should anyway, but the deportation thing is an extra bonus [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] )

[Rounder9999]

Since I cannot speak from years of experience as a professional poker player, I can't begin to tell you what you can expect if you do decide to make the jump to "full time" as a poker player. I can tell you that at 19 years old, I would put the number of hours I've logged playing against most anybody, so I can somewhat speak of the general lifestyle. As I was reading some of the other poster's responses, I couldn't help but give you some of my thoughts....

First of all, I am very bothered by the alleged stigma that comes with being a "professional gambler/poker player." I have obvioulsy had my fair share of run-ins with a number of ignorant people who can't open their mind to the idea of playing poker for income, but I quickly disregard their opinion for the simple reason that they are mearly uninformed about the subject.

As far as contributions to society, this is and will always be in your hands regardless of your exact profession. Volunteer, donate to charity, do a variety of things that can give you a great amount of satisfaction as far as giving back to your community.

I was mostly bothered by a poster claiming that a poker player is not a good profession to have as a role model for your children. In my book, showing your children that you can truly pursue your dreams by doing what you want with your life, while at the same time being able to do more things with them is about as good of an example a father can set.

From the day I started playing poker, I have had nothing else on my mind besides doing it full time. You are in a very unique position possessing the skill and the apparent discipline it takes to make it. You only live once, so spend it doing what makes you happy regardless of what anyone else says.

[Python49]

Who gives a flying f*ck what other people deem "honorable"? I know i certainly don't. If i'm doing something I LOVE to do for a LIVING, you can't put a price tag on that. While other people in their honorable positions are tied down to their job and have no escape even though they hate it and wish they had some freedom. If anyone told me that poker wasnt an honorable profession i'd simply tell them i'd rather play cards from the comfort of my home or in a lovely casino than to hump a 9 to 5 with a boss looking over my shoulder. That is all.

[A_PLUS]

I think that is very telling that you mentioned how you like teaching when you used to love it. From the experiences of those I know, situations like this rarely reverses. Meaning in a year/two from now, you are much more likely to dislike teaching than you are to love it again.

It is rare for anyone to have an opportunity to achieve elite status in a field that they love. You have that opportunity, and passing on it will most likely continue to trickle into other forms of your life (i.e. teaching feels more and more like work).

The only reason I can see for not turning super pro is you children/wife. Yes, you will have more time to spend with them overall (hours/year), but the schedule associated with a traveling pro is very tough.

Can you play your best game, if you have to travel accross the country when your children are sick, have a basketball game, just generally miss you? One of the great things about internet poker is the physical proximity you enjoy with your loved ones. Are you prepared to miss some important steps in your children's life (1st steps/words) b/c you are playing poker? Even when you consider it a job, I would expect that their will be more guilt associated with it than if you were teaching.

I think you will need to give this a shot for your own well being. Just try to work out every detail of your family situation before hand. The best aspect of your situation, is that you have a career that allows for exit-reentry (Che had some good thoughts on this). If you gave it a shot and failed, you could resume your current situation with relative ease.

I wouldnt worry too much about your children's view of having a poker player vs professor as a father. If playing poker allows you to spend more time with them and makes you happier, it will outweigh the negatives of having to tell their 1st grade class that daddy is a poker pro.

Good luck, the WPT isnt going to know what hit it.

[CardSharpCook]

Yo, man. Chase your dreams.

[Che]

[ QUOTE ]
I was mostly bothered by a poster claiming that a poker player is not a good profession to have as a role model for your children. In my book, showing your children that you can truly pursue your dreams by doing what you want with your life, while at the same time being able to do more things with them is about as good of an example a father can set.

[/ QUOTE ]

[CardSharpCook]

As a response to other posts:

I like the post that says "contribution to society is not determined by profession"

As a Pro, my working hours have increased dramatically since making the switch. Before it was 20 hrs a week, now it is 40-50. I hate it, but I'm putting in the hrs. If you treat it like a profession, then no, it isn't difficult to commit the hours.

Stigma, shmigma - if you have people who love and support you, as Sirio does, then it really doesn't matter. Having met David's beautiful wife, he really is lucky in the support department. She told me, "Poker pays for our family. David likes to teach, and it makes him happy, but poker is providing for us."

Poker is around to stay. Fish will always be numerous and players as good as Sirio will always be able to take advantage of that.

I don't think that Sirio will have a problem returning to teaching if he so chooses.

Finally there are many posters on this site and in this thread who are hobby players or addicts that have difficulty seeing poker as a "hard way to make an easy living". These people just don't look at it the same way as "we" do. I remember a recent thread in the limit forum in which sobedude is trying to tell someone that by folding 44 to a $60 river bet on a $1000 pot isn't going to lose him $1000 (a river ace likely counterfeited his boat on a AATT4 board). It may cost him somewhere btwn 0$-$50, but you can't look at it as missing out on a $1000 pot. the guy didn't get it. It is just two different mentalities, and I think you are also seeing that here.

sorry, this is just drivel.

CSC

[sirio11]

First, I'm really impressed by the quality of the responses, I just wish I have posted this before (Have been thinking on this for months). You gotta love this forum.

Now, trying to answer some of the questions or to complete information:

As today I just teach in the spring and fall (Feb-May, Aug-Dec), they always offer me to teach summer courses, but I have always declined to do it, because in the summer I can play full time and travel with my family wherever we want to go for a month or weeks if we choose to.

I'm a lecturer, I'm no tenure-track, so losing years toward the tenure it's not a problem. As gumpzilla pointed out, my only responsability is to teach, 4 classes per semester, this is 12 hours, but I would say I spend between 16-20 hours a week total including all the related stuff. Che is right about the 1 year contracts. I know there are good people looking for a job right now that can replace me, but I'm prepared that if they think this is not in the best interest of the University, then I'll stay another semester, or a year.

I spend about 35-40 hours a week with poker related stuff, then it's between 50-60 hours a week "working" in the spring and fall. All those hours are taking their toll on me, and of course, in the quality time I spend with my family.

I know that if I don't teach, not necessarily all the time is going to go to poker, and thats ok, as long as working is less of a burden, I think I'll have a more productive life.

I think lecturer positions are not that hard to find at Universities across the US, as today, but this could change in the near future. I have a very nice teaching curriculum, hopefully a hole in it, does not impact it much.

I don't have the experience to travel the tournament circuit in a regular basis. Last June-July, I was in Vegas for like a month, most of the time my family was over there, but I know this is not going to be the case most of the time. It's hard to predict how this is going to impact my family. We think about moving to a city near LA or Las Vegas, that's another big decision.

As adanthar said, I'm from Mexico, as today I'm a resident in the US, my wife is an American Citizen, and I'm planning to become one as soon as I can. I don't think there will be a problem for playing poker online, but with this administration, you never know. I'm more concerned about having problems, because of my strong anti-war stances [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

To do what you really enjoy is one of the main reasons to make this decision, right up with doing what is best for your family.
As today I really enjoy playing, and teaching has become more of a daily grind, of course there are still wonderful days when you can see how you were able to teach somebody a hard concept and how they enjoyed it, but those are far and between, and I think this is not likely to reverse as A_Plus pointed out. I already do some extra-curricular activities that Isura advised to do, like working with gifted students, preparing them for the Mathematical Olympiad contests, but I do this for free, so it's not part of my job, and I plan to continue doing it.
I understand that the daily grind also happen in poker. It has happened to me in the past, when I just don't enjoy playing at all; and you know what I do, I just don't play !!

The psychological changes proposed by USC are an interesting take and should be considered plenty.

When somebody asks what do I do for a living, I always says proudly I play poker, and I always enjoy how they look confused. Don't know how respectable as a profession is, but that does not bother me at all.

I think I'm a little naive about the economic implications in the future, for starters, I don't own a house, and don't know how much of a hustle is to buy one as a profesional poker player. I don't have enough information about 401k, stocks and the best way to invest your money, Definetly, I need financial advise. I liked spee's advise on this matter.

Che is right on, about how you can contribute to society. I have thought ways of doing this, I have even thought about teaching how to play poker to a large group of friends so we can generate a big bankroll and invest in some community projects and crazy ideas like that, but the point is, your contribution to society it's up to you.

I totally agree with Rounder about "showing your children that you can truly pursue your dreams by doing what you want with your life, while at the same time being able to do more things with them is about as good of an example a father can set".

Sorry for the long post, but you guys give me a lot of feedback to think about.

David