Should I be happy with 1.5 bb/100 at $5/10 Party game?

[dantheman_05]

i have plaed 20k hands of 2/4 shorthanded in order to improve my game before i played the 25k of 5/10 by the way. i think that is the only reason why i am above 1bb/100 in this tighter game. im not quite sure how to play certain groups of hands like small pairs adn Axs because i do not have a large enough database to know how well or bad these hands are performing for me yet. also for some reason AA has been running very bad for me..only 70% winrate with it which is very odd. its hard for me to see how 2.5bb is possible at this level while playing 4 tables though. one other thing, i beleive a player on 4 tables must use gametime (and know how to apply the info). i couldnt be at 1.5 without it.

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im not quite sure how to play certain groups of hands like small pairs adn Axs because i do not have a large enough database to know how well or bad these hands are performing for me yet. also for some reason AA has been running very bad for me..only 70% winrate with it which is very odd. its hard for me to see how 2.5bb is possible at this level while playing 4 tables though. one other thing, i beleive a player on 4 tables must use gametime (and know how to apply the info). i couldnt be at 1.5 without it.

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Don't be concerned with how the hands perform "overall" since there's really no such thing. Worry about how to play each hand correctly in the context of the situation.

If you say the game is tight, then suited Ace littles lose their value, unless you're in a steal situation. Middle pairs should be played aggressively pre-flop to limit the field.

Also, are you observing the texture of the flop/board and taking the proper line given said texture? This is especially important when deciding how to play an unimproved AK, AQs post-flop.

Are you paying off too many turn raises and then paying off a river bet with a naked top pair? Are you checking cards with outs and betting cards with no outs? (I know that axiom is simplified, but it's an important fundamental.)

Are you taking free-cards with marginal draws? Are you pushing your semi-bluffs too far against opponents you know will call you down? Are you semi-bluffing at playing zone boards, ex. 89 on JTx board. This type of board will touch a lot of hands and the success of semi-bluff is minimal.

Are you taking the free showdown in position enough with marginal hands that could, but might not be best?

How do you play top pair, weak kicker from the blinds? And depending on the texture of the board and your opponents, sometimes it's better to lead and other times it's better to check and evaluate the action, and then make a decision. I think this is an underrated concept.

Do you attempt enough turn steals after the flop has been checked through?

Hey, 1.5 BB is pretty solid. Just keep learning. If you haven't read Middle Limit Poker by Ciaffone, it'd help you tremendously in these type of games.

[LImitPlayer]

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2BB/100 puts you in the top 5% of all players.


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2BB/100 is very doable

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You are contradicting yourself

[Moss Factor]

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2BB/100 puts you in the top 5% of all players.


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2BB/100 is very doable

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You are contradicting yourself

[/ QUOTE ]Incorrect. Someone who studies the game and is actually aware of a) what a winrate is, b) things they can do to improve their winrate, and c) is actively doing these things makes 2BB/100 doable if you put in the time.

Just because that poster thinks that only 5% of all players do this doesn't mean that its not something which is not necessarily extrodinarily difficult to attain.

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2BB/100 puts you in the top 5% of all players.


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2BB/100 is very doable

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You are contradicting yourself

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Nope. In fact, he specifically stated that it 1 in 20 people do it, which sounds very doable to me.

[dantheman_05]

if any of you would like to contribute something helpful to this thread besides arguing i would appreciate it

[LImitPlayer]

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Nope. In fact, he specifically stated that it 1 in 20 people do it, which sounds very doable to me.

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So you think that having a 95% failure rate makes something very doable?

What would you consider hard?

I don't agree with his statemet [ QUOTE ]
2BB/100 puts you in the top 5% of all players.



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I was just pointing out that a 95% failure rates doesnt seem very doable to me

[pudley4]

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Nope. In fact, he specifically stated that it 1 in 20 people do it, which sounds very doable to me.

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So you think that having a 95% failure rate makes something very doable?

What would you consider hard?

I don't agree with his statemet [ QUOTE ]
2BB/100 puts you in the top 5% of all players.



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I was just pointing out that a 95% failure rates doesnt seem very doable to me

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It's widely recognized that only 10% (or fewer) of all poker players are winners. Yet it's also widely recognized (around 2+2 anyway) that it's incredibly easy to beat the low-limit games. These are not contradictory statements.

[sthief09]

at 25k ahnds you ahve absolutely no way of knowing your winrate or even a reasonable estimate of it. worrying about .5 is a waste of time. it's not like yoru range is 1.2-1.8. it's more like -.5 to +3.5. so you can be upset that you're not a 4 bb/100 winner, but worrying that after 25k hands you're only at 1.5 is really dumb. at 20k hands at 5/10 full I'm at like .7 bb/100, and in all other games combined, which si mostly 5/10 6m to 30/60 I'm around 3. does that mean I just suck at 5/10 full?

[goodguy_1]

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With good table selection I believe that 2-2.5 BB/100 is very attainable for an excellent player. I would guess an expert type might be able to do better.

That said, although there are usually a few excellent games around and several good ones. I think it might be tough to maintain that rate 8-tabling over a long stretch of hands.

I imagine a bunch of people are probably doing it... but again if they can 8-table 5/10 at 2BB/100 over the period of time needed to "prove" the WR with any degree of confidence.... then they are probably costing themselves money.


[/ QUOTE ] I doubt there are a "bunch" of players 8-tabling $5-10 Full for more than anything resembling 2.00-2.50 bb/100. Those that are 8 tabling the best have a lower bb/100 or are moving up to $10-20 or $15-30. There are rarely 8 let alone 6 usally only 4 "good" Party $5-10 Full games going on off peak nites. I know I play this game everyday. There are very good games at Paradise and Stars has had some great games of late. I just think the idea that a bunch of guys are 8-tabling the $5-10 Full for those winrates isnt a reality. Now 4-tabling sure 2.00-2.50 is very doable for the best players at $5-10 Full. $5-10 Full is a wasteland for rakeback players..must regualrs play somewhat well..the games are usually tight and too just assume that since you see a 17/9/2.50 that you cant outplay him/her is not a reality. $5-10 full is great because you can make 7-7 1/2cents in rakeback almost 50% more than $3-6 Full abit more than $3-6 6MAX and only a liitle bit less than $5-10 6MAX(ie 7cents vs 8cents).

I was doing 2.25bb/100
for my first 10K than ran horrific broke even over 6K hands and now I'm back at grinding these games. IMHO if you are 4tabling 2.00bb/100 is doable with very good game selection and that means playing other sites specifically PokerStars. 8tabling 1.00-1.50 bb/100 -reads are just too important at $5-10 Full..Most pots are heads-up onnthe turn and you need to tuned into your opponent. ABC does not work at $5-10 8tabling like it does at $3-6 .This is the first limit on the way up to higher games where you need to start paying attention..ABC doesnt cut it.

1.50 bb/100 is commendable multi-tabling but I think if you spread your wings a bit and scan other sites 2.00+ is doable..in other words nice job. I'm right there with you.
I cant wait to move up over $5-10. I think both of us should take shots at "good" $10-20 and $15-30 games many of these games yes have higher variance but offer better action than typical $5-10 game.