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  #1  
Old 07-08-2005, 03:02 PM
wpzone wpzone is offline
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Default Questionable hand

I was going through some hand histories today and found this. No reads at all, first hand at the table.
Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (6 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, SB calls.

Turn: (6 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, SB calls.

River: (9 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB caps</font>, Hero ??

By the time it gets back to me, its 18BB. Do you pay the 2 BB getting 9:1 against a possible boat(T9, J9, A9, AA, JJ, TT), knowing UTG will also call?
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  #2  
Old 07-08-2005, 03:27 PM
imported_The Vibesman imported_The Vibesman is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

I wouldn't fold. I don't know if you'll see trips and a str8 often enough to make it worth it, but I couldn't lay down the flush, I'd call. I'm interested to see the rest of the responses, because I have no confidence in my answer.
If UTG has a full house, that means he had two pair or a set on the flop (or maybe the turn if TT). Would he just call on both streets if that's what he had? Maybe the flush card on the turn scared him, but still. SB could have bet the flop with 89, stayed in the turn for his open-ender, and bet the river thinking trips might be good. Same thing goes for him with the full boat, he'd have at least a set or two pair on the flop or turn. But he doesn't even bet the turn at all.
As you can see, I find a lot of reasons to talk myself into calling when the pot is this large. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
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  #3  
Old 07-08-2005, 03:56 PM
glean glean is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

I'm also real interested in what others will say. Don't forget you have the K and Q of hearts out there too for a higher flush. Even tho I think hero is beat hear by atleast one of them I would probably call. I don't think your good hear 1 in 9 times, but it's pry prity close. Kinda hate over calling like that,two cold to boot, but since its 5 handed maybe they are just taking the "be more agro shorthanded" thing to heart. *shrug*
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  #4  
Old 07-08-2005, 05:22 PM
wpzone wpzone is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

any other comments? I'll post the results tonight.
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  #5  
Old 07-08-2005, 06:19 PM
jaxUp jaxUp is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

so, you have to be good 10% of the time. I would expect to see a slowplayed boat or high flush from UTG here about 55% of the time, and I suspect that SB has us beat about 25% of the time. So you're good maybe 33% of the time.
total times times one has it times both have it
100 - ((55+25) - (55*.25) ~33

If you think it's more likely that you're beat, it will be a closer call, but I think you can make this call with some degree of comfort.
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  #6  
Old 07-08-2005, 06:31 PM
joda mas joda mas is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

I would probably fold here unless you had a read that these guys were maniacs or just plain clueless. Most people won't 3 bet or cap with a flush/boat possible without a very strong hand.
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  #7  
Old 07-08-2005, 11:59 PM
wpzone wpzone is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

Here are the results, I called mainly because of the size of the pot.

Absolute Poker 1/2 Hold'em (5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (6 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, SB calls.

Turn: (6 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, SB calls.

River: (9 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB caps</font>, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 20 BB

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
UTG has Ad Ac (full house, aces full of nines).
SB has 9c As (full house, nines full of aces).
Hero has 7h 9h (flush, ace high).
Outcome: UTG wins 20 BB. </font>
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  #8  
Old 07-09-2005, 12:04 AM
Kumubou Kumubou is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

Wow, could UTG play top set any worse? Donk donk donk.

You played it fine, for what that is worth. The only thing that would concern me it that there is only one nine left, so anybody going insane with trip 9s is highly unlikely -- which means people waking up like woah on the paired board probably just filled up. (SB holds the 'miracle' hand, with the case 9 and the case Ace. Sucks for him.) No way in hell I get away from this hand, though. Buh.

-K
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  #9  
Old 07-09-2005, 07:02 AM
TomBrooks TomBrooks is offline
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Default Re: Questionable hand

...Fold. They see your flush. They both have full houses. Even if one of them is some kind of donk, at least the other one has a full house.

Edit: Just saw the results. I was right. Ding!
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