#1
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Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
Where can I find the hand convertor for 08?
Dealt to jgunnip [ Jh 2c Qd Ah ] actiomman calls [$0.5]. tampafrog folds. MM1MM1 calls [$0.5]. Chevy_44 calls [$0.5]. Choteau folds. trekkie2 checks. jwpoet calls [$0.5]. brimelian calls [$0.5]. jgunnip calls [$0.25]. collee checks. ** Dealing Flop ** [ 7h, 4c, Th ] jgunnip checks. collee checks. actiomman checks. MM1MM1 checks. Chevy_44 checks. trekkie2 checks. jwpoet bets [$0.5]. brimelian calls [$0.5]. jgunnip calls [$0.5]. collee calls [$0.5]. actiomman calls [$0.5]. MM1MM1 calls [$0.5]. Chevy_44 calls [$0.5]. trekkie2 calls [$0.5]. ** Dealing Turn ** [ 9c ] jgunnip checks. collee bets [$1]. actiomman raises [$2]. MM1MM1 calls [$2]. Chevy_44 folds. trekkie2 folds. jwpoet calls [$2]. brimelian folds. jgunnip calls [$2]. collee calls [$1]. ** Dealing River ** [ Tc ] jgunnip checks. collee checks. actiomman checks. MM1MM1 bets [$1]. jwpoet raises [$2]. jgunnip folds. collee calls [$2]. actiomman folds. MM1MM1 calls [$1]. jwpoet shows [ Ad, 5s, 4d, 4s ] a full house, Fours full of tens. collee shows [ 9d, 9s, 6h, 8h ] a full house, Nines full of tens. MM1MM1 doesn't show [ 7s, 7d, 3d, 2s ] a full house, Sevens full of tens. collee wins $23 from the main pot with a full house, Nines full of tens. There was no qualifying low hand. I'm fairly new to O8. My thoughts on the hand are that preflop it is a fairly strong starting hand that wants to see a flop. On the flop, I yet have a hand but I do have many strong draws (16 cards to the nut low, 5 cards to the nut flush, and 4 cards to the nut low and flush, plus a backdoor straight draw). I'm think this might be a good spot to check raise if the riase occurs where there are a lot of callers before it gets back to me. As it turned out the bet came from late position so I just called to induce overcalls. The turn was not a helpful card but I felt my draws were still strongso I called. I didn't catch anything on the river so I had to let the hand go. All comments welcome. |
#2
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
I'd call. Your getting very enticing odds and you have a strong draw. Then again, what do i know, i've never played a hand of Omaha Hi-Lo in my life [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img].
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#3
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
Let's see, with the betting and number of players, there is probably another A-2 and at least one player with a set going to the river. So we have:
4 Kings for high ~ 100% of pot Qh for nut high = 100% of pot 3h,5h,6h,8h gives nut high and puts nut low for ~75% of pot three 3s, three 5s, three 6s, three 7s for nut low ~25% pot So 5/44 cards give 100% of pot-11.3636% pot equity 4/44 for 75%-6.81% pot equity 12/44 for 25%-6.81% pot equity Roughly, you have 25% equity in the pot. Therefore, as long as the pot is $8, which it was, good call. Of course, you must beware that you can be caught in the middle. Colle might have re-raised and it could've been capped, making it $4 on the turn. Also, there are potentially 2 other A2's out there. With 2 other A-2 players, the calculations are: 5/44 cards for 100% of pot-11.36% pot equity 4/44 cards for 2/3 of pot-6.06% pot equity 12/44 cards for 1/6 of pot-4.54% pot equity totals 17.41% The pot was already $14, so yes a $2 call is OK, but it would be dreadful to get caught in a raising war here. On the positive side, when you hit your card for a high, I guarantee that someone or ones will pay you off at that level of table for just a bet more. Even without the math, I'd call this every single time, but it was fun to see the numbers back it up. I also might have raised the flop. |
#4
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
Holy crap...i forgot to put the 3 off-suit 8s in the calculations and that two clubs were out there. The Kc is probably no good now, so subtract that 1 card. However, the 8d and 8s are great cards.
They would be good for ~75% of the pot with one A-2 and ~2/3 with two A-2s. The 8c is good for either 25% of pot or 16.66%. Your odds just went up a little. |
#5
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
I'd have raised for value on the turn.
By my count, you have just over 6 million outs here. With 4 opponents, you only need 20% equity in the hand to make raising correct and you have an OESD + nutflush draw +nut low draw. If you assume the other opponent who folded was going to split with you for both the A2 and QJ and had a flushdraw you were still EV positive here. pokenum -o8 ad 5s 4d 4s - 9d 9s 6h 8h - 7s 7d 3d 2s - jh 2c qd ah - ac 2d js qc -- 7h 4c th 9c Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 28 enumerated boards containing 9c 4c Th 7h cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV 5s 4s Ad 4d 1 1 27 0 1 9 0 0.054 9s 9d 8h 6h 6 11 17 0 0 8 0 0.304 7s 2s 7d 3d 1 1 27 0 1 9 0 0.054 2c Qd Ah Jh 2 5 19 4 0 0 12 0.286 Js Ac Qc 2d 2 6 18 4 0 0 12 0.304 |
#6
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
I agree with gergery (and still LOL at the 6 million outs comment), but I would definitely raise the turn, though I was thinking that might be perceived as being too aggressive. I'm pretty new to the game myself, but that was my first thought.
Nice to see the math too . . . |
#7
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
[ QUOTE ]
I'm fairly new to O8. My thoughts on the hand are that preflop it is a fairly strong starting hand that wants to see a flop. On the flop, I yet have a hand but I do have many strong draws (16 cards to the nut low, 5 cards to the nut flush, and 4 cards to the nut low and flush, plus a backdoor straight draw). [/ QUOTE ] 3rd, This is an awesome hand especially against the crap that everyone else is playing (9s 9d 8h 6h, and 7s 2s 7d 3d). Flop, I would jam this, bet it out and hope you get raised, stop being so tricky. A checkraise would also give away your hand. <font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre> http://twodimes.net/h/?z=1067768 pokenum -o8 jh 2c qd ah - ad 5s 4d 4s - 9d 9s 6h 8h - 7s 7d 3d 2s -- 7h 4c th Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 528 enumerated boards containing 4c Th 7h cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV 2c Qd Ah Jh 94 137 391 0 270 36 12 0.421 5s 4s Ad 4d 18 32 496 0 53 238 6 0.097 9s 9d 8h 6h 33 200 328 0 0 275 0 0.221 7s 2s 7d 3d 71 159 369 0 57 234 6 0.261 </pre><hr /> Turn, Bet it again. You just picked up a OESD with a scoop out ( Any King), This adds 4 more scoop outs, to your collection of scoop outs. <font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre> http://twodimes.net/h/?z=1067778 pokenum -o8 jh 2c qd ah - ad 5s 4d 4s - 9d 9s 6h 8h - 7s 7d 3d 2s -- 7h 4c Th 9c Omaha Hi/Low 8-or-better: 32 enumerated boards containing 9c 4c Th 7h cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV 2c Qd Ah Jh 10 11 21 0 12 0 0 0.438 5s 4s Ad 4d 1 1 31 0 2 9 0 0.062 9s 9d 8h 6h 9 19 13 0 0 10 0 0.438 7s 2s 7d 3d 1 1 31 0 2 9 0 0.062 <font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre> |
#8
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
I would raise preflop. I would put as much money in on the flop as I could. I would flat-call on the turn, because I want to keep in customers to pay me off when I hit.
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#9
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
thanks for the replies. I'm finally getting a better idea of when I should be getting agressive after the flop.
As for raising with this hand before the flop. I'm in the small blind and while building the pot would be nice. I still only have A2 with a suited ace. If the queen had been another wheel card or a suited king with the two then I possibly see raising. But as it was, I didn't really have all my cards working together and I can't imagine that raising would be much more +EV than completing. |
#10
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Re: Call two bets on turn w/ nut low/flush draws?
[ QUOTE ]
thanks for the replies. I'm finally getting a better idea of when I should be getting agressive after the flop. As for raising with this hand before the flop. I'm in the small blind and while building the pot would be nice. I still only have A2 with a suited ace. If the queen had been another wheel card or a suited king with the two then I possibly see raising. But as it was, I didn't really have all my cards working together and I can't imagine that raising would be much more +EV than completing. [/ QUOTE ] Your hand is a monster, and well worth raising for value against that many opponents. |
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