ok, how do you play AK.. here's how NOT to play it.

[MrBrightside]

I complemely torched this hand. Down to 50 or so in $25 NL tourney. Pays 30. Only guy at the table who has me covered. He's a solid player, but has been very agressive and likes to see a fair amount of flops. For instance, it would never have occurred to me to make the preflop call he did here.


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (10 handed) converter

SB (t2715)
BB (t4526)
UTG (t2587)
UTG+1 (t3006)
UTG+2 (t2525)
MP1 (t165)
Hero (t5418)
MP3 (t7400)
CO (t2035)
Button (t1895)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t150, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+2 calls t150, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t800</font>, MP3 calls t800, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, UTG folds, UTG+2 folds.

Flop: (t2125) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets t1200</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t2700</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 raises to t4800</font>, Hero calls t1918 (All-In).

Turn: (t11543) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

River: (t11543) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: t11543

In retrospect, checking the flop is horrible. I could have figured out where I was much cheaper than trying a check raise (he was fairly committed at that point).

What I was really torn on was the call of 1900. Here's the Deal: I was pretty sure I was beat. I thought there was a possibility of a flush draw and nothing else (say with AQs), but AJ was a very real hand for this guy. If it was the beginning of the level, I would have kept my 1900 and tried to build, but this was the LAST hand before we went to 100/200 and that made my decision to go ahead and call. (the difference between 12.5 BB and 9.5BB).

Later, I really kicked myself for the mess here, but especially the call. I should have taken my lumps.

what do you think?

Oh, previewing makes me see the converter didn't put the results. He had AJ and I was out.

[sekrah]

You pretty much described it perfectly.. Just gotta do it when it counts now.

If you bet 800 or 1200 out at the flop, he probably moves all in and it's a much easier decision.

[MrBrightside]

what do you think about calling the last 1900. Realizing the horrible situation, I had no choice, or should I have saved it and tried to come back? I pretty much made a disgusted call. I get in these hands and I don't THINK. Plus, I play mostly sng's and am not used to bigger stack, post flop play.

Did I mention that I took all but 100 chips from this guy 45 minutes earlier with 33 on a 10 10 3 flop and he came back? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[BoneCollector]

Make a continuation bet of half the pot on the flop, if you get raised, lay it down, if you get called and dont get an A or K (non-spade), check and let go. You don't have any chance here.

[fnord_too]

Like you say, definitely lead the flop. MP3 is not going to raise without a real hand if you lead unless he has good nerves. Getting almost 4:1 after the reraise, I think you have to call the push, but you should never let yourself get into that situation.

If you had deeper stacks, the check raise on the flop is fine if it would not commit you. This hand really illustrates why you need to pay a lot of attention to stack sizes (both yours and your opponents). On the flop, if you lead villain is risking much more of his stack by playing on than you are. If you check, you give villain the opportunity to threaten your whole stack while risking less of his. I know in either scenario calling and folding to further action is possible, but the only time someone calls a bet on this flop planning to fold to more action is if they are planning on making a move later in the hand if the initiative is releinquished. (Except for people who would call with spades and fold on the turn if they miss, but that line is pretty bad most of the time.) (Really, I am struggling to think of a hand that makes either side calling and folding to further action a good line with this board and these stacks.)

[MrBrightside]

thanks fnord. I see what you mean about the chip stacks. I understand such things OK, I think, with regard to SNGs, where most of the play is preflop (I have an ITM of 38% at 20s and 10s over 140 tourneys), but I'm still learning MTT play.

[mmbapmashida]

What do I do here if I lead the flop, and he smooth-calls? Check-fold?

[fnord_too]

[ QUOTE ]
What do I do here if I lead the flop, and he smooth-calls? Check-fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

Make a difficult decision which will usually be checking and folding to a bet, though sometimes you can fire a second barrell. (Then there is the question of what to do on the river if it is checked through on the turn an no draw comes in. Make a blocking bet? Check call, if so what size bet? Check fold?)

Leading and getting called makes things very tricky IMO. If only we got to play all of our strong pre flop hands in position post flop!

[joeboe2001]

It looks like you are thinking one play at a time.

If you were going to check on the flop, you should have folded after he raised. If you were thinking about betting on the flop (or even check raising), you should have went all in on the flop--maybe he would have believed your "set."

It is obvious he didn't "believe" anything when you re-raised him.

[MrBrightside]

thanks everyone, for the advice. Some good thoughts here. With the help of everyone, maybe I'll win one again eventually. I won a $20 about a year ago, and haven't made a final table since.