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View Poll Results: Who is/was most clutch?
Derek Jeter 9 2.98%
Joe Namath 4 1.32%
John Elway 22 7.28%
Barry Sanders 1 0.33%
Joe Montana 41 13.58%
Brett Hull 0 0%
Mario Lemieux 5 1.66%
Willis Reed 5 1.66%
Kirby Puckett 7 2.32%
Alex Rodriguez 1 0.33%
Michael Jordan 70 23.18%
Wayne Gretzky 21 6.95%
Magic Johnson 10 3.31%
Larry Bird 19 6.29%
Kirk Gibson 7 2.32%
Curt Schilling 11 3.64%
Brandi Chastain 4 1.32%
Franco Harris 0 0%
Bobby Orr 3 0.99%
Gordie Howe 2 0.66%
Johnny Unitas 1 0.33%
Randy Johnson 2 0.66%
Robert Horry 9 2.98%
Chris Moneymaker 5 1.66%
Adam Vinatieri 24 7.95%
Patrick Roy 7 2.32%
Christian Laettner 7 2.32%
Diego Maradona 3 0.99%
Jimmy Connors 0 0%
Shaq 2 0.66%
Voters: 302. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 06-17-2005, 08:58 PM
Pinlifter Pinlifter is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 14
Default Bet or Check

The Hand: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] in the BB
The Flop: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
The Particulars: Party 2/4, no reads, 3 opponents(sb has folded), 4.5 sbs.

edited for clarity
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  #2  
Old 06-17-2005, 09:06 PM
shadow29 shadow29 is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: ATL
Posts: 178
Default Re: Bet or Check

I guess that you're first to act here.

I bet this. You've got good folding equity against three opponents and your hand is quite likely to be best. Moreover, giving a free card really sucks.

If raised, however, my action would depend on the opponent. Probably make a loose flop call and check/fold the turn UI. Also, I don't think making the flush is improving. I'd really hope for a King, I think.
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  #3  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:23 PM
UVaHoo UVaHoo is offline
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Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 37
Default Re: Bet or Check

I have trouble folding unless the flush card comes on the turn or river. Too likely someone holding the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] will raise to take a free card.

Obviously if the opponent is typically passive, then it would make me more strongly consider folding.
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  #4  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:42 PM
shadow29 shadow29 is offline
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Default Re: Bet or Check

[ QUOTE ]
I have trouble folding unless the flush card comes on the turn or river. Too likely someone holding the A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] or Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] will raise to take a free card.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. An aggressive opponent will raise a singleton high club here. But,

[ QUOTE ]
Obviously if the opponent is typically passive, then it would make me more strongly consider folding.

[/ QUOTE ]

don't most 2/4 players fit into this category? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
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  #5  
Old 06-17-2005, 11:34 PM
JoshuaD JoshuaD is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: NJ, USA
Posts: 341
Default Re: Bet or Check

I'm already thinking about seeing a showdown on the flop. People screw around like crazy with the board is 3-flush. If you've got two guys battling it out you can fold, but if you've got one guy raising you, see a showdown and consider donkbetting the river.
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  #6  
Old 06-18-2005, 12:07 AM
youdnf youdnf is offline
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Posts: 44
Default Re: Bet or Check

Id bet, most likely. If someone calls id wouldnt be to happy about my hand, and proablly fold to a reraise on the turn. If someone raise, it depends on your oppenet, because alot of people will raise with 4 to a flush here, so id proablly call down then and hope for a 3 or a K(not as good) not a flush.
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  #7  
Old 06-18-2005, 12:18 AM
Stu Pidasso Stu Pidasso is offline
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Posts: 779
Default Re: Bet or Check

Check,

If a bet comes from late position checkraise to knock out any small clubs(but larger than 3) out.

Stu
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  #8  
Old 06-18-2005, 12:25 AM
CallMeIshmael CallMeIshmael is offline
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Default Re: Bet or Check

Check and see.
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  #9  
Old 06-18-2005, 12:41 AM
jstewsmole jstewsmole is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: taking the nutz on the chin
Posts: 192
Default Re: Bet or Check

[ QUOTE ]
Check,

If a bet comes from late position checkraise to knock out any small clubs(but larger than 3) out.

Stu

[/ QUOTE ]

Its always apparent the last bet is to try to pick up the pot alot of times. By Check raising here i think u find out alot of info.

U might have someone slowplaying the nut flush when they just call ur check raise. Maybe someone with a lone club like J or Q might be calling here as well. A made flush that is smaller would make it 3 bets if they were smart or wouldve bet out on the flop to get immediate value.

If ur check raise gets everyone to fold but the original bettor lead the turn if it is raised ur beat if he doesnt have a flush hell probably fold even a better king IMO.
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