ak... gotta win with it, or maybe just don't play it?

[kuro]

You're thinking about it wrong. Big stack villain at the final table open raises with a large range of hands something like AA-22,AK-AT,Axs,KQ,suited connectors KQs-65s, 1 gap suited connectors KJs-75s. Your AK is a dog to AA/KK, but it dominates the Ax,Kx hands and folds out the suited connectors/small-mid pairs when you raise because of the fear of an overpair. The push at the final table is not an overbet because a normal sized reraise would involve you betting half your stack and after that you're pot committed anyway. As you get closer to the final few players, chipev and cashev diverge a great deal but at the start of the final table unless everyone at the table is extremely short stacked other than you and the biggest stack then I think this is a clear push.

The second situation is very different. When you overbet AK you are announcing that you don't want action and that this isn't AA-QQ. A normal sized raise here probably fold out more of the hands that you don't want to race with as a result and if villain pushes over the top of you then you can be pretty sure you're looking at AA/KK/AK/QQ and so you fold without a read to the contrary.

[baronzeus]

You should have layed this down preflop.

Then, you should have layed it down after the flop.

[PimplyTeen2]

phil2,

No reason to mock me at the end of your comments. I have only been playing for two years and enjoy it quite a bit. I have been learning about the game constantly and have no problem talking to others about it , who are amateurs. I don't go and make fun of them though and mock any success they may have! No biggie...

I play very well before there are about 25 people left, yet I have trouble getting to the final for some reason. I believe it is mainly because of the way I miss play big cards(ak,aq,kq) and midrange pockets towards the end of tournaments. I appreciate people's comments talking about not getting involved with big stacks, I think that makes a lot of sense. Part of me though likes to get in big pots with big stacks, because of the risk reward. Don't forget the guy that flopped a set with his eighths came in first place.

Here are some comments I have about the other comments posted above:

One of you said it was a good idea to make a raise and the other player will fold hands that aren't huge, however , that is exactly what didn't happen. Rather , the villain called with pocket eighths for a quarter of his stack with the only other big stack at the table in a split-second. When I check raise him all in, he really had to have a big hand to call. As it turns out , he hit a one in eight shot for one fourth of his stack. So who played hand incorrectly? Me or him? Not that I need to feel justified by him playing it wrong, but want others opinions on how to play this in the future.

One of you said how do you know that it was a steal raise? I suppose that is a pretty good point. I really didn't know that it was a steal raise. The biggest giveaway for me is when someone raises one unit around back obviously wanting action on their big hand. In this case , he raised more than one unit and thus it seemed like a steal. Those rockets are so powerful at the end of tournaments that it is almost catastrophic to get them folded to you. That is my opinion at least, so I rarely raise three times plus the big blind around back... I will take the chance of someone flopping a huge hand and cracking my aces... sound fair? I see where I may have misread this in should be a little more careful in the future. Then again , he had the only hand , that really sucks! Not sure if I have any regrets.

Finally, someone said that I overplayed my hand. The problem , I find is that if I play it weak, I get myself in a sticky pot where I am guessing what he has. Isn't the adage " have to win with ak and have to beat ak"? I suppose I could play ak weak tight in that spot, but could hardly see myself getting away from an a or k on the flop. If I happened to know more about the player, I could get off of an a or k flop, but otherwise , why play the hand if you can't play it for the best flop possible? I do hear you on that point though, makes some sense.

[kuro]

[ QUOTE ]
One of you said it was a good idea to make a raise and the other player will fold hands that aren't huge, however , that is exactly what didn't happen.

[/ QUOTE ]

Trouble is that you didn't make a real raise. There's a huge huge difference between villain calling 12K into a 29.5k pot with 88 than calling a push. Can you see why? Guy might still call you if you push, but it's pretty wrong for him to do so.

[Phil2]

[ QUOTE ]
phil2,

No reason to mock me at the end of your comments. I have only been playing for two years and enjoy it quite a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]

I apologize, you are right...I wasn't really trying to "mock" you or offend you. Perhaps I was being a little too sarcastic. My point was, don't let the past or other situations affect the way you play your hands in the moment. Again I am sorry if I offended you.

[juris]

Phil's post did come off a tad bit too smug.

AK is a hand to play against the big stack at the final table, for the very good reasons Kuro identified. So a fold is too weak.

How to play the AK is the key. If they smoothcall, and don't push the flop, I generally interpret that as a strong overpair or a hand that was upgraded on the flop (set, flush or OES draw). Proceed with caution and depending on stack sizes of all involved, a fold is no longer a weak option. Many many times at the final table or 3 I will smoothcall with a small pp and if there is no paint gambool it up. AK is a likely victim of this type of play and a huge dog to me after the flop.

Hand 2, you're overbet gives you away. Kuro also explained this to a T.

Conclusion: AK is a difficult hand to play properly b/c, well, it depends. But AK v. pp is common when the blinds get huge so I think it's fair to say yes you're going to win some with it, and lose some with it-but there are other factors (stack sizes, position, blind size) that should also be part of the consideration.

[PimplyTeen2]

I except your apology , no problem.

About playing hands in the moment, I agree with that, except . I think it is clear that I was wrong to make a weak raise into another big stack who "appeared" to be stealing. So, the next time I was faced with this situation i put the decision on him and pushed... again . problem was he had aces.

I completely agree that each situation is in and of its own, however it seems I am always stuck with a tough decision with the old ak towards the end of tournaments. As well , it seems the players that are accumulating chips are winning the chips with ak or silly big pocket pairs. Basically, you have to find a way to get paid with these big hands . when the blinds are going up and people are torpedoing out of tournaments.

See what I'm saying? Or should I be more cautious with my reasonable stack at the time?

[Phil2]

[ QUOTE ]
I except your apology , no problem.

About playing hands in the moment, I agree with that, except . I think it is clear that I was wrong to make a weak raise into another big stack who "appeared" to be stealing. So, the next time I was faced with this situation i put the decision on him and pushed... again . problem was he had aces.

I completely agree that each situation is in and of its own, however it seems I am always stuck with a tough decision with the old ak towards the end of tournaments. As well , it seems the players that are accumulating chips are winning the chips with ak or silly big pocket pairs. Basically, you have to find a way to get paid with these big hands . when the blinds are going up and people are torpedoing out of tournaments.

See what I'm saying? Or should I be more cautious with my reasonable stack at the time?

[/ QUOTE ]

I do see what you are saying. I think that chip stacks and your position are real important things to consider when you pick up AK in tournaments. I don't believe that "cautious" is synomonous with "weak;" AK is a hand you should be agressive with, but it is probably better to avoid confrontations with large chip stacks. Pick on the smaller stacks. Make them make difficult decisions...if you have a tough decision with AK, and losing the pot will cost you the tournament, probably better to fold it. Good luck in future tournaments...