Questionable Late Street Play - Page 2

SteveL91 · #11 06-14-2005, 02:20 AM

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hmm see where i am from if we raise pf we bet the flop. feel free to go passive with AK, id rather win more hands.

EDIT: if you are not betting this you better say you're trying to check raise a late position bettor and slim the field down.

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Does this mean if four people limp in and you raise A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in the SB, you're betting a 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] flop?

aK13 · #12 06-14-2005, 02:24 AM

Irish:

I know that you think raising preflop usually means you should be auto betting any flop -- I have been doing it since I started playing. However, from reading the forums and learning from other posters, I am fairly certain that betting this flop in this situation is an error, one that I am just beginning to correct.

irishpint · #13 06-14-2005, 02:32 AM

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Irish:

I know that you think raising preflop usually means you should be auto betting any flop -- I have been doing it since I started playing. However, from reading the forums and learning from other posters, I am fairly certain that betting this flop in this situation is an error, one that I am just beginning to correct.

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i dont see how a SB after a pf raise is an error. if you were planning on check/calling, why not bet? even if someone hit something (other than trips) we're getting the odds to continue on, so i think we've got to bet. i go into check/call or check/folf when i raise pf and get a terrible flop. this, however, is just bad. and i bet it. i wonder if it matters, in the big scheme of things.

aK13 · #14 06-14-2005, 02:43 AM

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[ QUOTE ]
Irish:

I know that you think raising preflop usually means you should be auto betting any flop -- I have been doing it since I started playing. However, from reading the forums and learning from other posters, I am fairly certain that betting this flop in this situation is an error, one that I am just beginning to correct.

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i dont see how a SB after a pf raise is an error. if you were planning on check/calling, why not bet? even if someone hit something (other than trips) we're getting the odds to continue on, so i think we've got to bet. i go into check/call or check/folf when i raise pf and get a terrible flop. this, however, is just bad. and i bet it. i wonder if it matters, in the big scheme of things.

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I'm pretty sure the "bet if you plan to call" does not apply when we are drawing, but more for made hands. For example, say the pot is 5BB, you have 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] heads-up OOP against a very aggressive player on a board that is A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ...by your standard we should be betting the turn because "we're going to call anyway" instead of check/calling (ignoring the fact that we have fold equity by semi-bluffing).

Also, what if it is raised and/or possibly 3bet behind us?

TheWorstPlayer · #15 06-14-2005, 02:53 AM

hand 1: check the flop. aK's reasons are completely correct.

hand 2: well played. with a rock solid read you can fold the river. without one, played perfectly.

hand 3: well played until river. c/c river. he's not calling you with a busted draw and any made hand he has beats you. hope he bluffs his busted draw or checks behind with a hand that beats you.

dozer · #16 06-14-2005, 02:54 AM

while I disagree with auto betting the flop just because you raised preflop.
I would have to say that in hand 1, this is a very good flop for overcards and I would bet this. It is a very ragged rainbow board that most likely missed everyone and the pot is quite large so you should be trying to win it, also your hand could still be the best, and it has some show down value if you can get it heads up.

@bsolute_luck · #17 06-14-2005, 06:09 AM

hey arsisx- welcome! first order of business is to work on reads and post them with your hands. there are many ways to play hands, and it will vary. do a search for, i think the title is "when a read is not a read" by Entity. that should help.

hand #1: i don't know why people are check/calling this flop. it is perfect for overcards. pot is big, bet both flop and turn and try to take it down then. the turned c/r i would only like if you know Button to be a habitual "i bet when checked to" kind of guy or bets on flush draws. then the c/r is goot to get it HU and hopefully buy outs to win UI.

hand #2: i play it the same. pots too big to fold here for one bet and someone could easily be taking a shot at you. if not bet into, i'd probably have just checked behind on the river. check/calling the turn is weak IMO. no reason to give credit for the flush. easy to fold to a c/r based on reads.

hand #3: raise preflop 2nd in. try to get it HU with UTG limper (assuming he is loose/passive and limping in with garbage. tight players, i'd fold). otherwise it is a tough hand w/o reads. i think i'd go into call down mode after the flop 3-bet.