Early QQ

Sabrazack · #1 06-07-2005, 04:51 PM

QQ is a hand i have been having a bit of trouble with in level 1/2. What i am wondering is if QQ is good enough to put all your money in the middle with this early against a unknown opponent.

#Game No : 2170508948
***** Hand History for Game 2170508948 *****
NL Hold'em $10 Buy-in + $1 Entry Fee Trny:12893376 Level:1 Blinds(10/15) - Tuesday, June 07, 16:45:38 EDT 2005
Table Table 39808 (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: Kajin ( $785 )
Seat 2: Poorichard ( $800 )
Seat 3: Maradona112 ( $675 )
Seat 4: dandy9golf ( $785 )
Seat 5: HLMdk ( $685 )
Seat 6: GDM215 ( $830 )
Seat 7: Bidcount ( $965 )
Seat 8: Big_Daddy40 ( $730 )
Seat 9: HERO ( $960 )
Seat 10: imasap ( $785 )
Trny:12893376 Level:1
Blinds(10/15)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ Qc Qh ]
>You have options at Table 11099 Table!.
Poorichard folds.
Maradona112 raises [30].
dandy9golf folds.
HLMdk calls [30].
GDM215 calls [30].
Bidcount raises [150].
Big_Daddy40 folds.
HERO ??

schilling38 · #2 06-07-2005, 04:59 PM

I would call and play any flop that didn't have an A or K aggressively.

my .02

junkmail3 · #3 06-07-2005, 05:05 PM

What if you're against AA or KK from the start, which is one of the main reasons you're folding preflop (or an A or a K and no desire for a coinflip).

Do you play this the same way?

According to your line, you should have pushed preflop (with QQ over Ax or Kx).

jgunnip · #4 06-07-2005, 05:32 PM

I think pushing is quite ok here.

Kristian · #5 06-07-2005, 05:43 PM

Aye, I push too. At this level, you are more likely to get an underdog caller than AA or KK.

jwsly1 · #6 06-07-2005, 06:15 PM

I would rarely go all-in with QQ pre-flop (except maybe in head-to-head play). You are in the perfect position (on the button) so as others stated I would call here and see the flop first. I would do this for a few reasons:

1. If you raise, you are giving a chance for 'Bidcount' to re-raise you to all-in. Which I would not want at this point, too much of a chance someone has an A or K and could pair the flop.

2. You are going to be last to act on every next round of betting - so you can get an idea of how strong Bidcount's hand is, before he/she can read you.

3. As long as there is no A or K on the flop, hopefully 'Bidcount' will continue being the aggressor and put more money in the pot, before you raise after the flop.

Of course there is still always the chance that they have AA or KK -- so even after the flop I would probably bet the pot (about 400) and see how they react. If they re-raise that I would throw it away, although that is a hard thing to do.

Good luck

treeofwisdom7 · #7 06-07-2005, 06:23 PM

i guess you dont have reads on the guy. if you re raise you might as well push cuz a re raise would be about half your stack 400-500 ,

jgunnip · #8 06-07-2005, 06:38 PM

No offense but I think your play with QQ is WAY to weak. This is a 10+1 and QQ is a monster good double/triple up hand. If they have a weak A or K and would call the raise to 150 but fold to your push, then you would lose quite a bit of money by not pushing. If they have AQ/KQ or worse and would call a push, you are losing a lot of money by not pushing. If they have a PP worst than QQ and will call your push, you are losing A LOT of money by not pushing. If they have AA, KK, AK so be it but at least make all the other hands pay the full amount to see the rest of the cards.

RiverDood · #9 06-07-2005, 07:05 PM

Push as well. I think it protects the hand better.

If you're called, it's likely to be h/u against one opponent, which is fine. Expect to see JJ or AK from sane people, and AQ-ATs, KQs-KTs and TT-88 from nuts. You're the favorite in all cases.

You might take down the pot right away, which is OK, too. Yes, AA and KK are always a menace, but it's not clear you'll be able to get away from them if you merely call and play out the hand from there.

Also, if you merely call, there's enough money in the pot that all or most of the min-raisers may stick around. Then you're playing 5-handed and almost everything on the board becomes a scare card. Flush draws. Straight draws that can be filled with Broadway cards. Undercards that might create sets for someone. Not to mention A8s and other borderline crud that shouldn't be in the hand anymore.

I'm a little biased today because my 3x preflop raise with QQ didn't chase out a big stack with 44, and when the flop came three rags, my seeming winner walked into a 444 set. But I think the general principle holds regardless. Unless you're facing overwhelming strength preflop, play QQ hard preflop and look to go h/u or take down the pot right away.

treeofwisdom7 · #10 06-07-2005, 07:13 PM

[ QUOTE ]
No offense but I think your play with QQ is WAY to weak. This is a 10+1 and QQ is a monster good double/triple up hand. If they have a weak A or K and would call the raise to 150 but fold to your push, then you would lose quite a bit of money by not pushing. If they have AQ/KQ or worse and would call a push, you are losing a lot of money by not pushing. If they have a PP worst than QQ and will call your push, you are losing A LOT of money by not pushing. If they have AA, KK, AK so be it but at least make all the other hands pay the full amount to see the rest of the cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

i quickly edited what i put. because i can see someone doing this with 99 1010 JJ trying to scare away limpers.
but i do think a fold with QQ is correct at times.