Schoonmaker "Don't Quit Your Day Job" (yeah, it's long)

[QTip]

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you going through a downswing? if so, I hope you pull out of it soon. best of luck, it looks like you've thought this out pretty thoroughly. the important thing is that you don't feel like you wasted any time. whatever road that puts you on.

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I'm not on a downswing Kev. I'm really hoping for a downswing soon, as weird as that sounds. I want to mentally deal with a nice one before I make the leap. I just keep reading where people are discouraging players from going pro, especially with families. They make it sound so difficult, but it just doesn't seem that way to me. I'm trying to be as objective and open-minded as I can, but I'm not seeing where I'm thinking incorrectly anywhere, and I'm trying to pull on the great minds in this forum to flame my thinking if it needs to be flamed.

[meep_42]

Don't pay your house off. It is in your best interests to have the longest, lowest-rate mortgage you can have at all times.

Your mortgage interest is tax-deductable, and generally at a pretty low rate for borrowing. The deduction lowers the 'real' interest you pay, allowing you to better use any extra money in investments that make more 'real' income than the interest you pay.

-d

[MaxPower]

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At what level are you planning to play? Last I heard you were on the 2/4 side of bouncing between 2/4 and 3/6. If 2/4, I think you should bite the bullet and commit to moving up before you go full time. Even at 3/6, I'd worry that moving up before going full time might be the better move long term.

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Definitely move up before you go full time. Once you go pro, it will be very difficult for you to move up since you will be living off your winnings. When you move up, there is usually an adjustment period.

Also, I would have a least enough money in savings to pay your expenses for a year (not including your bankroll). Maybe that is conservative, but it will make your life a lot easier.

[krishanleong]

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IMO if anyone has thought things through and would never make such a move in haste, it is you. I have no reservations about you doing it.

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LOL, I agree. Most people make just 1 should I go pro thread. Not QTIP, he makes 13 considering from all different angles. I say this with the highest respect. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Krishan

[Wepeel]

I have a completely different outlook on the pro lifestyle after playing poker for my only source of income for 2 weeks. I just happen to be in a really good situation, just finished a rotation as a co-op engineering for a major automotive company and have the summer off and will be graduating in the fall, so I decided not to find another job and just play poker for 4 months. This 2 week period has shown me that this is something I could never do for long periods of time.

You can do all the convincing that it'll be easy to play 40+ hours of poker a week as you are at your job this long every week, but, when it's your only source of income and you aren't just playing for "fun" and supplemental income the downswings hurt and it turns into a much bigger grind than you think. I think there is a big difference from playing 10-20 hours of poker on your own time a week as opposed to 40 hours a week as your main job.

Personally, I've started on a huge upswing and am making more than I could make as an engineer right out of college playing 4+ tables of 3/6, but I don't think I could handle it for much longer than this 4 month period I plan to play. I tried convincing myself that I would play 40 hours a week and 4 table to get in 10k hands per week. However, I am only playing around 2/3 of that now that I am actually into the grind per week. If you seriously consider playing pro I would recommend making a schedule of hands to play over a given time and go play in the casino once a week to sharpen your game and try to enjoy the game at a slower pace and these games can be gold mines.

If I could recommend one thing, it would be to try and play the lifestyle for 4 months and see if you could maintain that lifestyle. And it seems like you have looked into all the things people normally don't consider, such as taxes, benefits, and insurance.

[MaxPower]

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The plan is to 8 table for 40 hrs or more/week.


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How many hands are you playing per month now? How many more do you think you will play when you go full-time?

[QTip]

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Don't pay your house off. It is in your best interests to have the longest, lowest-rate mortgage you can have at all times.

Your mortgage interest is tax-deductable, and generally at a pretty low rate for borrowing. The deduction lowers the 'real' interest you pay, allowing you to better use any extra money in investments that make more 'real' income than the interest you pay.

-d

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Are you serious Dan? That amazes me. My mortage is at about 6.5% I figured it up on a mortgage calculator and it ended up being about $350,000 in interest over 30 years. To build the place and buy the land, I paid $288,000. $280,000 of that is in a loan for 30 years.

[QTip]

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IMO if anyone has thought things through and would never make such a move in haste, it is you. I have no reservations about you doing it.

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LOL, I agree. Most people make just 1 should I go pro thread. Not QTIP, he makes 13 considering from all different angles. I say this with the highest respect. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Krishan

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LOL! I'm sorry...really...it's just me. Thanks, though.

[chief444]

You SHOULD be able to make 10% or so just basically giving you're money to an investment firm. The stock market has shown an average growth over the years of about 9% per year. So obviously you should expect more of a return going through an investment firm.

But I see nothing wrong with paying the mortgage off either. It's basically like taking a guaranteed 6.5% on your money as opposed to putting it at risk for a few percent more.

I've had bad luck with investment firms so choose carefully if you go that route. Some are about as clueless as you and I.

I think by the time you finally make the decision to go pro you'll be close to retirement anyway. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[flair1239]

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you going through a downswing? if so, I hope you pull out of it soon. best of luck, it looks like you've thought this out pretty thoroughly. the important thing is that you don't feel like you wasted any time. whatever road that puts you on.

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I'm not on a downswing Kev. I'm really hoping for a downswing soon, as weird as that sounds. I want to mentally deal with a nice one before I make the leap. I just keep reading where people are discouraging players from going pro, especially with families. They make it sound so difficult, but it just doesn't seem that way to me. I'm trying to be as objective and open-minded as I can, but I'm not seeing where I'm thinking incorrectly anywhere, and I'm trying to pull on the great minds in this forum to flame my thinking if it needs to be flamed.

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Here's one. Oppurtunity costs. You make what you make right now, what are the oppurtunites for advancement in your present field? Remember by leaving the job you are forfeiting any expected increases in Salary (obviously).

The only other thing is that the burnout rate for 8-tabling 40 hours a week has to be high. But I guess you would also be able to do a bunch of bonus whoring.

Also marriage pressures. You and your wife will be together a lot. This changes the whole marriage "dynamic".

That said, the long burnout and weekly income fluctuation would seem to be the main thing. If you can work around those, you will be good. Good luck.