What is a better strategy in these overpair situations?

QUADS4444 · #1 05-21-2005, 10:59 AM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (9 handed) converter

BB ($99)
UTG ($429.4)
UTG+1 ($159.6)
MP1 ($403)
MP2 ($205.8)
MP3 ($458.3)
CO ($690.65)
Hero ($224.82)
SB ($317.5)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $2.
3 folds, MP2 raises to $15, 2 folds, Hero calls $15, 2 folds.

Flop: ($36) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP2 bets $20, Hero raises to $80, MP2 calls $60.

Turn: ($196) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero calls $129.82 (All-In), MP2 calls $110.80 (All-In).

River: ($436.62) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $436.62

Results in white below: 
MP2 has 3d 3c (three of a kind, threes).

What would have been a better strategy, such that I would keep my losses to a minimum in these overpair situations?

Added information. Villian VP$IP is about 49% and PFR % is about 17%. No other read.

freemoney · #2 05-21-2005, 12:01 PM

villian has about 50 BB if he has AA or KK you give him your stack, this is not a time to just call behind raise preflop especially if you have trouble folding overpairs it makes the hand much easier and you give him incorrect odds to set, although you lose your stack in this situation also.

Rotating Rabbit · #3 05-21-2005, 12:15 PM

Recently in situations like these i've been experimenting with getting the least amount of money in on the flop as possible; against convention - calling or checking behind in situations like these on the flop heads up. The conjecture is the amount you lose when the cheap/free improves him is outweighed by the amount you save from situations like these, and you're more likely to get some money off a second best hand.

That said I've not got enough statistics yet to draw conclusions.

QUADS4444 · #4 05-21-2005, 12:46 PM

Against a player that I feared/respected I would have shutdown after his call of my raise on the flop. But with these loose/live/passive ones (VP$IP of 49%) I don't give them enough credit/respect, so I went all-in on turn after his check.

QUADS4444 · #5 05-21-2005, 12:52 PM

Are you saying to raise preflop to about $60? Do you then fold to an all-in?

Fuchida · #6 05-21-2005, 01:59 PM

As usual a lot depends on your read of the other player [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I would have been very nervous when he called the large raise on the flop. I like to have notes on players as to what hands they will raise or limp with in different positions or at least how often they raise. If this player would raise with 77 or JJ in middle position, then a bet of half the pot followed by that large a call suggests a set or maybe AA/KK. If they are prepared to call $80, why did they only bet $20?

I would probably check behind them on the turn, which seems a little timid but I would be very concerned that my one pair isn't winning. I have a sign on my wall which says in big letters "An overpair is still only one pair". That sign has saved me a lot of money [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The exception would be if this is a player with the combination of being prepared to bet with a draw out of position and to call without the odds on a flush draw. In that case, I would put him AI on the turn and pray.

If he checks the river, you check behind him. If he goes AI you would have to judge if that player would do that with something like AJ or as a complete bluff. If not, fold the overpair.

After saying all that, I don't think AI on the turn was a bad play but personally I try to avoid getting all my money in with just one pair unless I have a good read on my opponent.

Fuchida