1st adventure into Commerce 10-20: $10K pot

[stankybank]

So I buy-in for $5K and play a relatively tight-aggressive game but sometimes mix it up by raising w/ position and very rarely limping w/ trash hands to see if I can get lucky/tricky. Anyhow, I built my stack up to $5800 at its peak by picking up some small pots here and there. I've been playing at this 'main' table for about 7 hours or so when this hand develops. I can say that the table views me as 'tight', one of the players even went as far to say that I'm one of the two tightest players he's ever met. Shortly after this I got caught bluffing at a pretty decent pot when the board showed AxxAx; opponent had QQ. I bluffed off $500 or so. I think the table also views me as someone who does more raising than calling.

My stack is $4500. Villain to my immediate left is a tough, European player who has the entire table covered. I believe he's got about $7-8K. Guy who caught me bluffing is in this hand too but I can't say for sure if he was one of the blinds or UTG. Either way, he was first to act after flop. He has about $1100.

1 or 2 limpers to me and I limp w/ A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], tough Euro-player limps behind me. We're late position. Now that I think about it, guy who caught me bluffing was probably one of the blinds and he checks his option. 4-5 way to the flop for ~$100 pot.

Flop is 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. This is one of the few pots I hit pretty hard and I tell myself that I'm willing to get all-in. I'm on the tail-end of a 12 hour session and I'm ready to go home. Guy who caught me bluffing leads out for $100. I call, tough Euro-player calls. I didn't want to raise because in case tough Euro-player had a flush draw, I didn't want to lose him. I also had enough outs and I wanted to bring along Euro's stack so that I can have a chance to double up off him. Comments?

Turn is 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. I complete my wheel. 'Guy' leads out for $200. I flat-call. Euro-player raises to $900 flat. 'Guy' goes all-in for ~$800-900 total. Here's where I pull a move I've never done before at this table. I raise to ~$1600 more or $2500 total. He says something like "How much more? I call". One thing I want to say is that before I put my raise in I was going through the hands he can possibly have and I put Euro-player on set, pair w/ flush draw, 2 pair + flush draw, or pair + straight and flush draw. I've seen him play some really trash looking hands so I'm sure he's more than willing to play something like the hands I described above. Also, I was playing with my stack of hundreds and looking at him he suddenly froze chip shuffling and just sort of sat there. I guess he knew I was raising or something and was giving off a tell or reverse-tell. Either way, one hand that beats me here is 56 and I don't put him on that. Before river is dealt, 'Guy' who caught me bluffing says "I need a diamond", so I feel I'm ahead of him here.

River is black 7. I go all-in for ~$2K more. Euro-player instantly calls.

Comments?

[Bosox]

This is well outside my range of expertise, but given the hands you put the villain on, maybe not such a bad situation? The straight is so hidden that I can see a set calling down. On the flip side, 5k on second nuts is a tough one. To tell you the truth, mostly i'm curious about how it ended up - last night i actually had a dream/nightmare about playing in that game.
cheerio

[topout]

The 7 doesn't matter and I'm going to ignore the river action because there are no decisions after that.

If he turned the straight, whether the 5 high or the 6 high he figures his hand to be the best. There had been a lot of strength shown and there is a large % of the stacks already in. A good player would raise here, so he shouldn't have the straight.
If he flopped a set would he slow-play with 2-flush board? It's not all that uncommon against 2 opponents.
I'd love to put him on the big draw, but you have the big draw cards.

If you believe UTG, 6 diamonds are accounted for.

My best guess would be he has TT or the straight.

If he's on the draw, you want to check to induce the bluff because he isn't calling.
If he has a set, he'll check behind but might pay you off, not figuring you for playing A5 or 56 so you want to bet.

You shouldn't fold this for $2K, so check fold is not an options.

I think your play is correct.

topout

[AZK]

What do you think a "tough" player is playing while putting in 2k? Maybe he is slowplaying top set and not giving you credit for the straight since either one A5 or 56 is a gutshot. But everyone is playing so deep there really is no mistake calling the flop bet with a gutshot, more of a mistake for him since he can't have 6d5d, but still.

I had a VERY similar hand a few weeks ago, you can search for it if you just look me up. Anyway, a lot of people suggested getting as much money in on the turn as possible, this is the exact same situation, I would have tried to get as much as possible in on the turn. Forget the other player, getting all in with the nut low and a redraw against the shortstack is good enough. I think $2500 is too small of a raise.

[Doctaprofit]

I am almost positive european player has a set or 56. More than likely, pocket 2's or pocket 4's. Pocket 10's would of warranted a raise, especially in late position. Its great that the diamond didnt drop if he has a set because he might of thought u were betting a missed draw. If the board paired, and you checked and he put you all in, do you call?

[stankybank]

[ QUOTE ]
I am almost positive european player has a set or 56. More than likely, pocket 2's or pocket 4's. Pocket 10's would of warranted a raise, especially in late position. Its great that the diamond didnt drop if he has a set because he might of thought u were betting a missed draw. If the board paired, and you checked and he put you all in, do you call?

[/ QUOTE ]

Good question. I thought about this before I even re-raised him on the turn and I couldn't really decide for certain. If the river was a diamond, I was planning to check. If the river paired, I was planning to lead out for a bet and fold to an all-in.

[Doctaprofit]

i dont know if checking is the best call if the river is a diamond, especially after that guy makes the comment. The only way you extract money if the diamond drops is if he makes a complete bluff or happened to be on a lower flush draw which seems to me to be very unlikely, if he has the straight he definetly wont bet now and will be happy to see for free. With 2k left i would bet another 1000, hoping he would think i was bluffing the flush draw now. It seems to me checking is the worst thing you can do if another diamond drops. In addition if the board pairs, betting out then folding would seem to me to be horrible. You have 2k left, how much are you going to bet? In this situation, it seems he either has a set, or the straight and if he has the straight he will most likely call, if he has the boat he is definetly putting you all in, the best you can hope for if the board pairs is i dunno, a really oddly played overpair? I would check and if he put me all in, fold.

[Yeti]

[ QUOTE ]
If the river paired, I was planning to lead out for a bet and fold to an all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

edit - I'll stop being a cock and elaborate. Pot is around $6.3k on the river. You plan to bet $1k and fold your last thousand, getting 8.3-1? I don't like this at all.

[stankybank]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If the river paired, I was planning to lead out for a bet and fold to an all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh?

edit - I'll stop being a cock and elaborate. Pot is around $6.3k on the river. You plan to bet $1k and fold your last thousand, getting 8.3-1? I don't like this at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, those were my plans at that particular time and in retrospect, I was pretty married to my hand. In my mind, I was going through all the possibilities of Villain's hand and 2 pair or set were very possible. I most likely would've check called anything on a paired river but would've felt pretty sick in doing so. Not as sick as folding though. Since there was a decent side pot, I felt that checking on a diamond would show that I was scared and he might've tried to bluff at it or bet it with his flush since A) I'm a tight player and might fold had he not put me on diamonds and since there's going to be a showdown regardless, he knows that I know this as well and might try to put me off my hand. Since I played it weird, I don't think he thinks I have diamonds. B) If he has flush, he'll push. So, I'm getting two chances to get his money. If I push, he might fold because he knows he gets to see the showdown and might fold his set or 2 pair because he's got to respect the fact that I'm pushing on a flush card knowing he just called my re-raise behind me.

[Doctaprofit]

nt