Flush draw -value betting or insanity betting ?

MrG · #1 05-15-2005, 07:24 PM

PokerStars 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $1.
1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold, MP1 raises, 3 folds, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (11 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks, MP1 bets, Button calls, SB calls, BB folds, Hero raises, MP1 3-bets, Button calls, SB calls, Hero caps, MP1 calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Turn: (13.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 bets, Button folds, SB calls, Hero calls.

River: (16.50 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 bets, SB calls, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 18.50 BB

cold_cash · #2 05-15-2005, 07:26 PM

Nice hand.

Pov · #3 05-15-2005, 07:31 PM

Looks to me. You made a lot of money on that flop, made a profitable call on the turn and then got away on the river.

Stinkybeaver · #4 05-15-2005, 08:09 PM

Hi to all...

My first hand comment inhere, I'll try to do as many as possible without wiewing any other opinions.

I hope this over time will improve my own game and make me more aware of the many aspects of postflop play.

As for now I'm a newbie with approx 15K hands overall starting at 0,1/0,2 - then 0,25/0,50 and now I'm struggling at 0,5/1,0. I play the right ammounts of hands but I'm having problems with postflop play.

When all that is said and done I think your cap is fine thinking solely of your 1/3 equity with a nutflush draw. Certainly you can't count any ace as an out anymore.

Anyone who disagrees are very much welcome to quote and correct me this goes for all my comments.

istewart · #5 05-15-2005, 08:19 PM

Welcome beaver.

matt42s · #6 05-15-2005, 08:28 PM

I'm new to this so I'm doing it the long way -
the bettor is on your right, with 2 callers after, they'll almost certainly put in another bet, so the simple version of equity edge thinking works ie. you're contributing 25% of the flop bets and have ~35% equity.
the 3 bet from mp1 could mean anything JJ,QQ,KK,AA,AJ? smaller flush? but we should looker closer. for arguments sake, lets guess worst case. he has JJ - 6 clean outs to a boat,(24%) your flush draw now has 8 clean outs(31%) both will hit 7.5%. the flush is good at least 23.5% - so when the button and CO call the 3 bet, its great news - cap it. if one of them folded it would have been a harder decision but would almost certainly still be good to cap.
on the turn, your equity dives and its harder to guesstimate but is still good for somewhere 15-20%. you have pot odds for a call but not if its raised so the check-call seems best.
without reads, I would probably make a crying call on the river.
(but even the slightest indication that they're not BOTH complete donks would have me folding)

how'd I do?

SoftcoreRevolt · #7 05-15-2005, 08:48 PM

Thanks to all the flush draw hands lately, this hand felt all the more sweet.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO calls, Hero calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (7 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero raises, SB calls, BB 3-bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero caps, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls.

Turn: (17.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero calls, SB calls.

River: (23.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, MP1 folds, CO calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls, CO calls.

Final Pot: 30.50 BB

Buckmulligan · #8 05-15-2005, 08:54 PM

very nice hand.

Sykes · #9 05-15-2005, 08:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks to all the flush draw hands lately, this hand felt all the more sweet.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO calls, Hero calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (7 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero raises, SB calls, BB 3-bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero caps, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, CO calls.

Turn: (17.50 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, CO calls, Hero calls, SB calls.

River: (23.50 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, MP1 folds, CO calls, Hero raises, SB folds, BB folds, UTG calls, CO calls.

Final Pot: 30.50 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

Nh, but I'd be almost inclined to raise the turn with 15 outs.

matt42s · #10 05-15-2005, 10:25 PM

I just realised at least one mistake in my turn analysis, you do have pot odds to call a raise so betting might be better. if it is raised, the others may fold pairs or weaker draws for 2BB.