Am I a wuss?

[paulewalnutz]

I am very new here, I posted this in the high stakes but was told $1/2 and $2/4 belong here - so:

I don't have the benefit of fancy pokertracker hand histories, but made 2 laydowns last night that have been bugging me and I wanted to get some thoughts.

Hand 1:

First hand that I sit down, I post from LP, and get dealt J-10 spades. Everyone folds to me - I make it $8, BB is the only caller. Flop comes 10-3-2, with 2 clubs and a spade. I bet $15, he check-raises to 30, I make it $55, and he moves all in, making it about $95 for me to call (for a total bet of $150). Welcome to the game Pauly!

Hand 2:

I'm in LP with AJ spades, first playable hand I've been dealt in a while. The player to my left (MP) opens with a raise to $8 (he's been raising a lot), I make it $18, BB cold calls, and initial raiser calls. Flop is 7A7, no spade. BB bets $20, MP calls, I make it $50, BB makes it $100 with a min raise, and about $75 left after his raise.

Does anyone think I should have moved in or called on either of these? I am thinking that hand 2 may have been KK? I'm somewhat interested in thoughts on the rest of the hand but most concerned with whether anyone thinks a laydown was not the right play on either of them.

[emil3000]

These are 1/2 blinds right? If not, don't minraise.

Hand1: You should probably fold to the minraise on the flop, since you don't know the player. You have a weak hand, and he could only have one draw. Who the hell minraises oop with a flush draw?

EDIT: Both these hands are weak.

Hand 2: Unless he's been playing real crazy postflop too you're losing. I don't necessarily mind the preflop reraise, but once you're called you should proceed with caution. On the flop you're either far ahead or way behind. Your read of the player should dictate if you continue play. If you do so you must call, don't raise. Let him hang himself. If he leads again on the turn you should drop against all but the nuttiest players.

EDIT: Both these hands are weak, don't create big pots with weak hands.

[theweatherman]

Hand 1 I think is a fold. The only reason I hesitate is that acheck minraise looks very weak. The point of a check raise is to say "I have a good hand." The min raise seems fishy, but he could be trying to get more money in the pot with a set or so without scaring you out.

I would not reraise here, if I dont fold I am only calling and checking if he checks to me on the turn (If I dont improve). Even if I improve I am treding carefully sonce I put him on a set. To sum it up, Hand 1 is not a weak fold.

Hand 2 is different. If MP calls then I am done with this hand. However if it gets to be heads up with you and the BB then I might not. This is very similar to his line on the first hand, with a min reraise over you. Last time he pushed after you raised him so I'd be prepared for the same again.

In my opinion no one plays KK like this and its wishful thinking to assume he has it. You are either smoked by AK, AQ or x7 or you are smoking his Ax. This is a 50/50 push in my opinion. Always folding here is wrong, always pushing is wrong. The worst thing to do is cold call i think. Since you have not posted the stacks I have no idea what decision to make. But I imagine the stacks would allow for a push.

[paulewalnutz]

Interesting thoughts from you both.

Hand 1 - I just won't fold to a weak check raise of a continuation bet on that raggedy a flop.

On hand 2 MP did fold, after my raise and the BB all in. So the reraise of him preflop had its desired effect, he likely had AJ, maybe AQ. That leaves one A for the pesky BB but I obviously thought he had it, if he did he almost had to have AK. He had about $75 left and I had enough to put him in for all of it or close to all of it, and boy did I want to!

[TrailofTears]

You have already read my response in the M/H forum, but I'll repost it here, in case anyone has issues with it, or would care to elaborate on it:

Hand 1: Don't post in LP. Don't raise a great drawing hand like TJs (very often). You want more callers with this hand, and unless you are familiar with the other players and vice versa, and doing so for deception value, it is better to limp with it, especially in LP. The flop bet is fine. The 3 bet is bad without a read, and folding is clearly the best option here after his push.

Hand 2: Re-raise PF is fine for isolation value. We need reads on the players to make educated decisions past this point. If I go on basic 1/2 players, BB's cold call scares me, and his continued aggression on the flop must be AK, as no other hand makes sense. you have to fold here to his 3bet, as you are likely drawing very thin.

-T

[Ghazban]

Do you always wait for the BB to come around to post? There was a thread in Poker Theory a while back about if you should post behind the button or always wait. I don't remember the exact data, but I think the conclusion was that posting in the CO and CO-1 was better than waiting for the BB.

If you post in the BB, you're paying 1.5BB for 10 hands (.15 BB/hand). If you post in the CO, you get 7 hands for 1 BB (.14 BB/hand) and you have the benefit of position on a blind-posted hand (the first hand you play posting in the CO) which you never get if you wait for the BB.

Of course, if you wait to post and are paying attention to the table, you'll get some free observation time; I suppose that might be worth something.

[TrailofTears]

Yeah, I read the thread you are referencing. I don't find the numbers to be all that compelling as to why you should post in the CO, since I post once per table for a session. I would rather have a few hands to watch the table (Okay, that is a lie, since I never preview my tables or pay attention until I start playing, but some players might find it beneficial.) I guess I can't make a real argument against posting, I just don't do it because usually I am still getting situated and whatnot.

-T

[emil3000]

You'll get in some more hands/hour too.