Signing off/ 10,000 SNGs of data/ some FAQs

[zipppy]

[ QUOTE ]

What's the highest ROI possible at each level?

This question is much more difficult to answer. I think that after reviewing 10,000 SNGs you probably have a good idea about where peoples' ITM really lives, but to have any idea about ROI you'd probably need to review a few hundred thousand SNGs of data (to really get a good impression of how people are doing.) So here's what appears to be true, though I'm much less sure about this than my opinion about ITM:

A great $6/$11 player can probably sustain 30% or so.

A great $22/$33 player can probably sustain 22% or so.

A great $55 player can proabably sustain 18% or so.

A great $109 player can probably sustain 12% or so.

A great $215 player can probably sustain 6% or so.

I understand that there are players who have done much better than this over a large number of SNGs. I've done better than those numbers at just about every level for hundreds of SNGs at a time. Sometimes you're hot and sometimes you're not. When the dust settles, the above numbers are likely to live in the optimistic ballpark for even the best players.


[/ QUOTE ]

I thought it was interesting and worth noting that tonight I read a post you wrote in January, Irie:

[ QUOTE ]

For whatever it may be worth (probably nothing), here's my opinion on what good-great-max. attainable ROIs are at the various levels, playing 1 table. In parenthesis I'll put the multitable numbers assuming 8 tables at $11-$33, and 6 tables at $55-$215. This is for Party:

$11: 25%-35%-45% (20-30-40)
$22: 20%-30%-42% (15-25-37)
$33: 15%-25%-40% (12-20-32)
$55: 10%-20%-33% (8-16-23)
$109: 8%-14%-22% (5-10-18)
$215: 2%-10%-18% (1-6-10)

Some people would argue that you should flip-flop the numbers for the $10's and $20's. This is based on the theory that it's easier to win when you play against better players for more money... so I could be way off there.

Irieguy


[/ QUOTE ]


quite different numbers in the highest levels

[Gramps]

[ QUOTE ]


Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. You have mastered another analytical game such as chess, bridge, backgammon, or gin. World-class status at games of incomplete information like bridge or gin are particularly likely to improve your chances of poker mastery, and vice versa. Dance Dance Revolution wouldn't count.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Does Minesweeper count?
My score is 103 secs on expert.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, and here I thought I was God's gift to Minesweeper with a 111 back in the day (about 10 years ago). Forget high stakes poker - pressure is getting down to about 20 flags on the expert level in Minesweeper on pace for your record...

[Daliman]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The highest overall ROI sustained I have ever heard of in these is Gigabet at 17%

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know where you got Gigabet's figure from, but from my conversations with him, this is low.

Have you talked to Dr_Zoidberg2? Rojosox? ComeonPhish? Dr_Gammon? ActionMonkey? Gamboholic_? ElDiablo? Since my conversations with these players are private, I'll just say at least 3 of these players have claimed longterm ROI's over 20%. Also, none of those players are world class sit'n'go players, and most aren't even experts.

[/ QUOTE ]


Dr Zoidberg:Never heard of him

Rojosox: I am VERY familiar with Rojo's game. We talk alot. his % is around mine, maybe a bit higher, as he's new to 4- tabling.

ComeOnPhish: If his #'s are in double digits, I'll eat a shoe. Other good players I have spoker with agree; he's a 8-12 table grinder, that's all. Nothing special about his normal game at all, and lotta bad about it.

Dr_Gammon: A long time ago we chatted some, his returns were similar ti mine. No surprise, as I consider our games almost mirror images.

Actionmonkey: If he is Mistermo as is widely suspected, he told me long ago he makes $23 per, which likely has changed to worse as the games have gotten tougher.

Gamboholic: Yet another guy I'd eat a shoe if his ROI was higher than 9%. He's just not that good.

El Diablo: Last I heard, it had been quite awhile since he'd played these with any regularity, and the games have changed.

So I'm not sure who these 3 are that are over 20%, as at least 5 I'm anywhere from positive to alomost positive they are not, for varying reasons. People lie, btw.

[bball904]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. You have mastered another analytical game such as chess, bridge, backgammon, or gin. World-class status at games of incomplete information like bridge or gin are particularly likely to improve your chances of poker mastery, and vice versa. Dance Dance Revolution wouldn't count.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Does Minesweeper count?
My score is 103 secs on expert.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, and here I thought I was God's gift to Minesweeper with a 111 back in the day (about 10 years ago). Forget high stakes poker - pressure is getting down to about 20 flags on the expert level in Minesweeper on pace for your record...

[/ QUOTE ]

I definitely think Minesweeper counts. I may be the world's largest Minesweeper junkie and have recorded 89 seconds. If I open the game (which I don't very often anymore), I won't let myself go to bed until I post a 120 or less.

Edit: Whew, first try 117. Good night all!

[curtains]

It's very easy to lie and or not enter hand histories into PT when you have a terrible losing session. I personally know people who do this, it somehow makes them feel better, but have no idea why.

[lutefisk]

Hot stuff!

This thread has turned into a who's who from the past few months at least. I'm going to bump this so I can pretend to be associated with all you good players!

(dead fish posing)

"Only after the 10th punch will you see the fist, and only after the 20th will you block it." --Proverb from the game of Go

[checkers777]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. You have mastered another analytical game such as chess, bridge, backgammon, or gin. World-class status at games of incomplete information like bridge or gin are particularly likely to improve your chances of poker mastery, and vice versa. Dance Dance Revolution wouldn't count.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Does Minesweeper count?
My score is 103 secs on expert.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, and here I thought I was God's gift to Minesweeper with a 111 back in the day (about 10 years ago). Forget high stakes poker - pressure is getting down to about 20 flags on the expert level in Minesweeper on pace for your record...

[/ QUOTE ]

I definitely think Minesweeper counts. I may be the world's largest Minesweeper junkie and have recorded 89 seconds. If I open the game (which I don't very often anymore), I won't let myself go to bed until I post a 120 or less.

Edit: Whew, first try 117. Good night all!

[/ QUOTE ]

I havent' played in a while, but my best time for intermediate level was 19 seconds, and for the advanced level, 69 seconds. Yes, I confess, I used to be a minesweeper addict.

[FieryJustice]

All the college kids are amazed that I can beat the easy level on minesweeper...They must all be dumb. I beat the intermediate level once and I thought I was the [censored]. You people all pwn me.
Jcardshark

[hummusx]

[ QUOTE ]
All the college kids are amazed that I can beat the easy level on minesweeper...They must all be dumb. I beat the intermediate level once and I thought I was the [censored]. You people all pwn me.
Jcardshark

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd have to see a video to even believe that someone could beat this in the times people are talking. After that, I'd never open the game again for fear of feeling completely inadequate.

[pergesu]

I beat expert in like 4 minutes once...man did that rock