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#21
04-28-2005, 10:31 PM
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Re: Sgrena Lied
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] FWIW the europeans and australians in my lab refuse to believe this and are firmly entrenched in their beliefs that it was a cold blooded murder, even in the face of now strong evidence to the contrary. these people are some of the best, brightest and most educated individuals in their respective countries. fim [/ QUOTE ] So do you now agree with me that US has a serious image and credibility problem (many republicans try to deny this)? And have you noticed it has escalated in GWB'precidency? [/ QUOTE ] wow. do you get the fact that you're agreeing that such an image problem is the fault of european stupidity and not american international policy? I even agree with you somewhat in your viewpoint, but this is quite possibly the worst way to ilustrate it that i can think of. here's an analogy if you don't get the above: would it be effective for me to say "this guy is a wacko because he doesn't even believe the earth is flat?" do you get how silly and contrived your post is? fim 
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#22
04-29-2005, 01:00 AM
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Re: Sgrena Lied
Here's another possibility:
-The Italian drivers may have thought that the U.S. troops were more terrorists and were afraid of stopping. The U.S. troops see a speeding car that won't stop when signaled. It may just have been a very unfortunate accident where both sides did the right thing. Possible?
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#25
04-29-2005, 08:30 AM
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Re: Sgrena Lied
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] FWIW the europeans and australians in my lab refuse to believe this and are firmly entrenched in their beliefs that it was a cold blooded murder, even in the face of now strong evidence to the contrary. these people are some of the best, brightest and most educated individuals in their respective countries. fim [/ QUOTE ] So do you now agree with me that US has a serious image and credibility problem (many republicans try to deny this)? And have you noticed it has escalated in GWB'precidency? [/ QUOTE ] wow. do you get the fact that you're agreeing that such an image problem is the fault of european stupidity and not american international policy? I even agree with you somewhat in your viewpoint, but this is quite possibly the worst way to ilustrate it that i can think of. here's an analogy if you don't get the above: would it be effective for me to say "this guy is a wacko because he doesn't even believe the earth is flat?" do you get how silly and contrived your post is? fim [/ QUOTE ] If intelligent people gets to such a conclusion you have a image problem prior to the incident. That was my point and it is valid.
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#26
04-29-2005, 10:34 AM
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Re: Sgrena Lied
[ QUOTE ]
Yes, makes sense. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah only if the driver of the car is a complete moron. Those checkpoints are clearly marked and there arent many terrorist running around with American uniforms on.
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#27
04-29-2005, 10:44 AM
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Re: Sgrena Lied
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] The point is she lied, got a lot of air time, and no ones ever gonna find out the truth. I'm sure there are plenty of crazy wacko Euopeans that do think US troops tried to kill her. [/ QUOTE ] I find this offensive, probably because it is so ignorant. [/ QUOTE ] FWIW the europeans and australians in my lab refuse to believe this and are firmly entrenched in their beliefs that it was a cold blooded murder, even in the face of now strong evidence to the contrary. these people are some of the best, brightest and most educated individuals in their respective countries. fim [/ QUOTE ] thats really not saying all that much..
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#29
04-29-2005, 03:29 PM
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Broken Glass Lied
There is nothing in your link that says she lied. [ QUOTE ]
source: Heard on CBS Evening News [/ QUOTE ] I heard you were a moron so I'm pretty sure it must be true. FYI - they were shot in the back and the US Military knew of their release. They were 1/4 mile from the airport. The attitude on this thread of blindly believing your government and some idiot who lionizes GWB is pathetic.
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#30
04-29-2005, 11:11 PM
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Shoot first, check the bodies later
[ QUOTE ]
Option 3: Italian drivers were reckless and the journalist just happened to be a nutjob. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, nice try, misdirecting this to the usual stereotype of "reckless Italian drivers". As if driving on an Iraqi road is the same as driving through Milan traffic. That “communist Italian nutjob” is alive now only because her guardian was killed, when he shielded her with his body. He was anything but a communist, in fact. He was a highly competent member of the Italian intelligence services and an experienced hostage negotiator. I find the whole episode a tragic reminder of how trigger happy the American soldiers have been in Iraq since the first day of military operations. IMO, there can't have been any "conspiracy" to kill Sgrena, as she implies, because the idiocy displayed by the American side all through that war simply is not that high to commit such a PR blunder. That the American soldiers have been trigger happy is a fact of life. I'm sure there are many people on these pages who are quite "happy" with such an attitude and totally "support the troops" when they fire in all directions and ask questions later, but thousands of Iraqi civilians (and, now, an Italian non-combatant) paid the price for that. When the American tanks first rolled into Baghdad, Iraqi civilians who found themselves in their general path, unarmed men on the sidewalk, women raising their hands in the universal symbol of surrendering, children peeping out of a door, even dogs, were cut down where they stood by "precautionary fire". A wave of metal thunder, indeed. The Italians would have a far better chance of surviving if that had been a British roadblock.
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