Did I save a bet or free card myself out of the pot?

Apoc · #1 03-17-2003, 07:04 PM

Typical online $1/$2 game -- pretty loose passive with very little bluffing.

I get K [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] in UTG+2 and call after an early limper. (too loose?) Button calls, SB completes, and BB checks his option. Five to the flop.

K [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img]

This has been a tricky situation for me, with top pair and a less than enthusiastic kicker. SB, BB check, EP bets and I raise to try to knock out any single hearts that I can. Button folds, SB calls two cold, BB folds and EP calls. Three to the turn.

8 [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img]

Check, check...I decide to check both because I'm worried about my kicker and b/c I'm worried about a made flush. I figure I'm either a little ahead or way, way behind. I know this means I'll probably have to call the river unless another heart falls, in which case I'll fold.

River: A [img]/forums/images/icons/club.gif[/img]

SB checks, EP bets (uh oh), I call, and SB folds.

How would you play it differently? Appreciate any comments!

Ed Miller · #2 03-17-2003, 08:09 PM

I would bet the turn because 1) you figure to often have the best hand here, and 2) you can fold to a checkraise. You need to be betting the turn in these situations.

J.R. · #3 03-17-2003, 08:13 PM

I would have bet the turn, although it sounds like it didn't matter here. I assume you lost to the A of hearts or a made flush, neither of which were going anywhere for a bet on the turn.

cferejohn · #4 03-17-2003, 08:15 PM

I do think that playing K9s UTG+2 is too loose. I would only play this from the blinds or in LP with several limpers. It can make a non-nut straight (or the single-card nut straight), the non-nut flush (unless the A of the suit falls), and top pair, bad kicker, all of which stand a chance of being a second best hand that you can't get away from, which you especially want to avoid in EP.

elysium · #5 03-17-2003, 10:20 PM

you never should have entered here.fold pre-flop.once in , now fold on the flop.you have no chance.

davidross · #6 03-18-2003, 11:35 AM

Bet the turn and fold to a raise. If you are called I would check the river fearing a better kicker, but not the flush. By checking the turn, you are opening yourself up to bluffs, and you almost have to call. If you are going to call the river you might as well put the bet in on the turn when people still think you have the flush, and may fold a hand that could beat you on the river. Plus you make a singleton heart pay for the chance to hit his flush.

Nottom · #7 03-18-2003, 12:56 PM

I actually like your play here ... I think this is actually a good example of drawing out the bluff here as the only card you are really afraid of is the Ah or maybe an AT. Your hand is likely the best, but very vulnerable and a bet is not going to do anything to help it on the turn.

Checking the turn however has the added benefit of making a worse hand bet into you since it looks like you were semibluffing a flush draw and taking the free card on the turn.

Additionally, I don't think limping in with K9s is such a bad play after another limper. I play it quite often after a limper or 2 from EP or MP.

FletchJr. · #8 03-18-2003, 01:06 PM

Without looking at any of the replies, I'll post my opinion.
Flop, call. if UTG is betting a king he may have you already beat, if he's betting a single high flush card, he's goin to call your bet.If you do raise here, you can't give the free card on the turn, you put him on a hand you could beat and when the blank hits the turn you have to make him pay. Check the river after if your scared.
Turn, This is where you take off the gloves if a 4th suited card doesn't fall. This puts extra pressure on the button, sb, and bb if they called the flop. Now they got to call 2 BB's. If they 3 bet you can pretty much summarize that your hand is already dead.
River, if you have doubts that your hand isn't good, you'll probably have position by this time and can check it.

FletchJr. · #9 03-18-2003, 01:13 PM

"Your hand is likely the best, but very vulnerable and a bet is not going to do anything to help it on the turn. "
Please explain how a bet is not going to help much on the turn. I think the poster here is not going to improve that much and has to make hands that he already has beat pay to out draw him. I may be wrong, but what about hands like mid pair, medium heart. Like a 10,J. with the Jack of hearts. Or even any hand with a heart. I'm sorry i just don't understand this, Please explain.

Apoc · #10 03-18-2003, 02:58 PM

For those of you interested, EP took it down with A [img]/forums/images/icons/heart.gif[/img] 3 [img]/forums/images/icons/spade.gif[/img] He probably wouldn't have folded to my bet on the turn, but I am inclined to agree with many of the posters that I should have charged him the max to draw for the flush.

Thanks for the comments and feel free to add anything additional about my play.

Peace and love,
Apoc