NL & limit

[grimel]

Can someone tell me WHY I suck royally at limit and stay ahead at NL? My PT stats are nearly identical for near identical numbers of hands.

The easy answer is only play NL, but, there are a lot more limit games with a lot more fish.

Is there some basic concept at limit that I'm just not getting?? I am trying to learn to play at least break even limit. I want to play winning limit up to say 5/10?

I guess my real deep question is how do I learn to play limit? I've read (couple of times) SSH, HPAP, & HP. I think I'm following the concepts. Somewhere I'm not getting when to fold/raise/check/call/throw my computer across the room/scream.

What is the big diff between limit and NL. I'm missing something small and it's costing me BIG TIME.

[Guruman]

the main difference between the two games is in the intention of your bets and raises.

In limit games, if lots of people are in you will often have odds to chase drawing hands - but you will not always be able to bet enough to offer improper drawing odds for opponents. The net effect here is that bets and raises in limit are usually for value, sometimes for information, and only very rarely for bluffs. You can play a much wider variety of starting hands in limit than you can in nl because of this as well.

NL games give you a different set of tools than limit games. Since you can bet any amount, you can do things like bet half the pot into a player that you think is drawing when you have top pair and automatically ruin his odds. This bet also works as a great bluff, since it won't usually cost your whole stack if it gets called. Opponents of course can do this to you as well, which greatly devalues your drawing hands since you'll almost never get odds to call unless you're up against a very passive player. You can also do things like raise 4x or 5x the big blind to isolate weaker hands against your unpaired broadway starting cards. NL bets and raises are usually for isolation or odds crushing purposes, many times for value, occasionally as bluffs, and rarely as pure information gatherers (your bluffs do that better).

In general, winning limit players have to be much more subtle in how they extract money from opponents than NL players. You have to show down a winning hand a lot more in limit than you will in NL, but you'll sometimes get odds to chase a monster when it doesn't hit you on the flop. NL is more about getting ahead and staying there.

[grimel]

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In general, winning limit players have to be much more subtle in how they extract money from opponents than NL players.

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I'm about as sublte as a kick in the face.

Thank you. That makes sense. You can't play winning limit treating it like NL. Very good distinctions. That should be at least a couple of steps down the right road.

I knew there was a basic point I was missing.

[New York Jet]

[ QUOTE ]
My PT stats are nearly identical for near identical numbers of hands.


[/ QUOTE ]

You are probably playing a little too tight. I would think your NLH VP$IP should be at or below 15.00. Your Limit VP$IP should be between 15.00 and 20.00.

[nolimitpro2005]

im in the same boat here. i can play a winning session of limit here or there, but it's a matter of time before my bankroll crawls downward once more. the only times i lose in no limit are the times when some idiot sucks out on me, which is happening a lot more than i'd like (A4s vs AA, for example - catching a 235 flop, KK vs K9s and catching a miracle straight flush), or the rare times when someone traps me with a big hand.

[grimel]

Well, I thank you much. I've had 2 winning sessions at 1/2 limit. Granted 2 isn't much and I wasn't crushing it, but 2 wins vs 2 getting slaughtered is a big improvement.

The betting is a very subtle, yet profound difference. Completely changes how to read the bets.

[JaysonWeberFCP]

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...14&fpart=1

Download the "starting hands chart" and use it in excel, make it your best friend and use the tight tab unless your room is 60% seeing the flop. That should help