First Post Did I overplay KK?

elcap · #1 03-11-2005, 03:24 PM

Is this too aggressive w/ KK on the turn? How do you protect against the drawing hands here? Reraise the flop? My plan on flop was to call and push if draw card doesn't hit. I look forward to being more active in the forum as I have been playing many hours (170) in last 2 months and am really working to eliminate leaks in my game. One definite leak has been overplaying Overpairs and TPTK. I'll post results later.

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (10 handed) converter

MP2 ($117.35)
MP3 ($291.75)
CO ($187.10)
Button ($153.70)
SB ($258.05)
Hero ($110.65)
UTG ($72)
UTG+1 ($95)
UTG+2 ($318.60)
MP1 ($111.10)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
4 folds, MP2 calls $2, 1 fold, CO calls $2, 1 fold, SB completes, Hero raises to $10, MP2 calls $8, CO folds, SB calls $8.

Flop: ($32) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $22, MP2 raises to $44, SB folds, Hero calls $22.

Turn: ($120) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $56.65 (All-In)

Final Pot: $176.65

DoomSlice · #2 03-11-2005, 03:47 PM

It's fine, the only way to escape is on the flop... but unless you're sure that your opponent has a set (which the min-raise usually means!) then you are fine. The money is going in, draw or no draw.

Godfather80 · #3 03-11-2005, 04:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Is this too aggressive w/ KK on the turn? How do you protect against the drawing hands here? Reraise the flop? My plan on flop was to call and push if draw card doesn't hit. I look forward to being more active in the forum as I have been playing many hours (170) in last 2 months and am really working to eliminate leaks in my game. One definite leak has been overplaying Overpairs and TPTK. I'll post results later.

Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (10 handed) converter

MP2 ($117.35)
MP3 ($291.75)
CO ($187.10)
Button ($153.70)
SB ($258.05)
Hero ($110.65)
UTG ($72)
UTG+1 ($95)
UTG+2 ($318.60)
MP1 ($111.10)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
4 folds, MP2 calls $2, 1 fold, CO calls $2, 1 fold, SB completes, Hero raises to $10, MP2 calls $8, CO folds, SB calls $8.

Flop: ($32) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $22, MP2 raises to $44, SB folds, Hero calls $22.

Turn: ($120) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $56.65 (All-In)

Final Pot: $176.65

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, you may be against a set on this flop with the min-raise, but you are going to have to pay it off. I don't see anyway you can fold profitably given the action in the hand. There are plenty of hands (mid pocket pairs) that min-raise this flop trying to knock out AK and AQs.

But, why wait for the turn to push. I think you push after his raise on the flop if you were going to push on the turn anyway. Why let Ax of [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] hit is ace on the turn? If you're going to push on the turn, I think you may as well go over the top on the flop.

tbach24 · #4 03-11-2005, 04:23 PM

Raise more pre-flop. You're OOP with a bunch of limpers.

The flop play depends on what he'd limp/call with. If that a solid opponent, you'd be right to fold. Against a fish, I'd make that same play and expect to be shown 88 or something.

meow_meow · #5 03-11-2005, 04:32 PM

I don't get the stop and go.
If he is bluffing or semi-bluffing, you are giving him a free card. I like pushing on the flop more.

tbach24 · #6 03-11-2005, 04:38 PM

You push and he may let go of a small overpair that you want him in there with.

joewatch · #7 03-11-2005, 04:43 PM

I would strongly suggest that you always have at a minimum 75BB in your stack, otherwise you will be going all-in a lot in these types of situations.

Anyway, with this flop (str8-flush draw), I think you should have gone all-in on the flop, not on the turn. If you are going to show weakness on the flop by calling, you should be check-folding the turn.

elcap · #8 03-11-2005, 05:10 PM

You guys are great, thanks for the feedback so far. You guys seem to say that the mini-raise generally indicates set. At the time I was thinking the mini raise likely was a draw trying to push me off AK or smaller pocket pair. I have started to fold in this situation more than I used. But here I thought if I push, my stack is not that big and he likely calls with flush draw and any overcards so I wanted to be safe, ensure a scare card didn't hit the turn (in which case I check fold), and push if it didn't. Result raiser folded A10c on turn. Anyways, thanks for any more input and I look forward to contributing to your posts in the future!

schwza · #9 03-11-2005, 06:12 PM

i probably would have pushed the turn. if you call and the turn is a club, do you really want to fold at that point? you'd have 1/2 your stack in the middle.