Q10s, did I make the most I could?

[calvin]

Hello,

This is my first post on the forum, but I would like to say I've been an avid reader for quite some time. I hope that I can contribute to the discussions in the future.

I have been thinking about a hand that happened quite some time ago, at Canterbury Card Club in MN, on a 3/6 table.

I had just sat down at the table, and I recognized a few faces, but was, for the most part, unfamiliar with how the game was. In my first BB, I was dealt Q10s of diamonds.

This is how the rest of the hand went, as far as I can remember:

UTG folds, EP player with a lot of chips raises, folds to LP player who I recongnize, loose, aggressive player, who reraises. Folded to me in the BB. I know my cold call of two bets might not be justified, but I knew the player in LP was fairly loose and aggressive, and the player in EP could be beat with any straight or flush I could draw to. Beyond that, I usually defend my BB with moderate to strong starting hands. My question is not about my preflop play though. Here is how the flop came down.

The flop was: [A K J]r.

I knew I had the best hand, for now anyway, and with the flop, I was positive there would be at least one bet behind me, so I checked, hoping to check raise (probably the aggressive raisor in LP). The EP player bet out, and the LP play raised. I re-raised, making it three bets. I was called by both players. I thought at least one of them had a set, and the other a strong ace, or maybe two pair.

I bet out the rest of the hand, and was called by both players on the turn and river. I believe the final board read something like

A K J 5 8, with no flush possible.

The player in EP turned over a set of jacks, and the LP player turned over AKs for top two pair. My questions though, are these:

If I would have bet out on the flop, is there a chance I would have been able to four bet the flop, and thus have another 1.5BB in the pot? Is it safer to check raise a made hand like mine, when I am sure there will be a bet behind me, or should I bet out when I am in early position, to protect it and hope for an extra bet? I can see the benefits of both plays, but I am not sure which play is the best.

Thank you for any replies and good luck playing,
Calvin

[Allan]

Welcome to the forum Calvin,

I would bet and raise every opportunity. If the LP players have a hand you will likely be raised then you can 3 bet. in this case it is likely you could have gotten 4 bets in on the flop. The range of hands that your opponent will be willing to put you on when you bet out is probably bigger than when you checkraise and this will lead to increased action.....There is also the small chance that the flop gets checked around. In the long run I think you make more by betting out....And sorry, but, yes QTs is a fold for 2 bets in your BB....

Allan

[RINCON]

Welcome Calvin. I don't know why you would want to checkraise the flop,If LP bet and you checkraised you could possibly lose EP player.With a flop like this it is bound to have connected with a least one of the raisers.I think betting out is a much better idea, hope to be raised.I can't believe the both just called the turn and river with such large hands.Going for a checkraise on the turn might of been a better idea but I can't fault you for betting,obviously neither one of your opponents was very aggressive.In all I think you played the hand just fine...

Good Luck,

RINCON

[Dynasty]

I thought at least one of them had a set, and the other a strong ace, or maybe two pair.

If you believed this, you made a big mistake by not check-raising the turn. That's where you lost bets on this hand.

You pre-flop call was very bad.

[bernie]

why are you trying to kill action by making a strong move? if the bet came from your right, your c/r could knock out many possible callers who can make 2nd best hands....but here you did a check reraise, which looks like it froze the table. and only collected for 1bb each on the turn and river...it froze the table so much, that the set didnt even try and raise you on the turn. which is a good indication that you used a move that was too strong. your image to them may have also played a factor...

sure, your str8 can be vulnerable to a set but...you do have some better options here...

id have bet out. if 3 bet, i might do a stop and go, or i might 4 bet...hard to say. i doubt theyd have put you on a str8 if you bet out. if im checking into them, im not raising here. ill blast the turn. maybe even just bet out on the turn...

with a check reraise, what hands do you think youre representing here? remember, that that is a strong ass move. theyll likely put you on at least a set themselves.

nothing wrong with playing it fast....at least ya got some bets in, but it's not always the most optimal...

b

[bernie]

"There is also the small chance that the flop gets checked around"

with players 3 betting preflop, it's highly doubtful this is going to get checked around. this flop likely hit at least one if not both of the pre-raisers.

b