2nd greatest football coach?

[IrishHand]

What does adding something to the game have to do with being a great coach? I thought a coach's job was to win, not be innovative. My mistake.

[marbles]

"Tom Landry invented modern day offense."
-And Knute Rockne invented the forward pass and basic backfield motion. Walsh is the master of the West Coast. Buddy Ryan is credited with the 46, and, depending on who you ask, either Martz or Vermeil invented the spread offense.

Yet none of them ever did more with less talent than Lombardi. And they'd be the first to tell you that (if they were all alive, that is). If great coaching were all about innovations, then yes, these guys would have to get serious consideration... But that ain't the half of it.

[RINCON]

Wins losses,and ties through 1996
For NFL teams active in 1960
Dallas Cowboys 318 wins 206 lossses and 6 ties 60%winnning%

49ers 293 wins 227 losses 10 ties 55.23winning%

Browns 286 wins 236 losses 8 ties 53.96winning%

Steelers 281 wins 241losses 8ties 53.01winning%

Tom Landry was a winner!!!

RINCON

[marbles]

All right, I'm really busy at work right now, so do me a favor and look up Lombardi's win/loss record and post that. And while you're at it, post the Packers record prior to his arrival (a decade or so ought to do the trick).

Landry was indeed a great coach... But he's no Lombardi.

[B-Man]

Wins losses,and ties through 1996
For NFL teams active in 1960
Dallas Cowboys 318 wins 206 lossses and 6 ties 60%winnning

Dallas was a powerhouse in the early 1990s, and won 3 Super Bowls. However, I fail to see how this helps your argument on Tom Landry since Jimmy Johnson and Barry Switzer were the coaches at that time, not Landry!

I agree Landry was a very good coach in his day, and yes, a winner. I disagree that he was the best coach ever, and I think you are hurting your credibility if you are trying to claim for Landry the accomplishments of Jimmy Johnson & Switzer (who admittedly had a pretty easy job since Johnson had built such a great team).

By the way, George Seifert had the best winning percentage in NFL history before he took the Carolina job, and won two Super Bowls, does that make him the best coach ever?

[IrishHand]

As requested (includes playoff games):

Vince Lombardi: 105 35 6 .740 in 10 years (top win % in history though not even top 25 all-time in wins)
Tom Landry: 270 178 6 .601 in 40 years (3rd in wins, 3rd in win %)

other notables:

Bill Parcells: 149 106 1 .584 in 15 years (13th in wins, 13th in win %)
Don Shula: 347 173 6 .665 in 33 years (1st in wins, 6th in win %)
George Halas: 324 151 31 .671 in 40 years (2nd in wins, 5th in win %)

Also...John Madden had a record that was nearly identical to Vince Lombardi's:
John Madden: 112 39 7 .731 in 10 years (23rd in wins, 2nd in win %)

[marbles]

"Also...John Madden had a record that was nearly identical to Vince Lombardi's:
John Madden: 112 39 7 .731 in 10 years (23rd in wins, 2nd in win %)"

Funny you should mention Madden. I once saw an interview w/Madden where he talked about meeting Lombardi. He had gone to a coaching clinic where Lombardi was speaking, and looked forward to hearing Lombardi talk for a few minutes on leadership, strategy, etc. Instead, Lombardi stood by a chalkboard and talked about the halfback sweep... For eight hours.

Madden said something down the lines of, "I didn't realize how little I knew about football until that day."

And if you're pointing to Lombardi's total wins as if it's some sort of flaw, I hope you realize how silly that is.

[IrishHand]

How about you re-read my post. I'm pretty sure exactly zero opinions were contained in it. Yes, I thought it was interesting that Madden had a similar record to Lombardi. I guess I should clarify that I found it interesting because I had no idea that Madden had such a good coaching record (to me, he's the fat guy who's on MNF and sponsors a good video game). Other than that, I have no opinion about the current coaching debate. I don't know nearly enough about pre-1990 football to have an informed opinion - which is why I didn't state one.

Irish