Please help me convince my friend that he's wrong... :)

[RiverRider]

Hi guys,

I know this is'nt the Tournament Forum but every times I posted here I got some good answers from good to great players so I prefer posting it here... But if this offend you, simply go to the next post... Or feel free to blast me. The other reason why I post this here is because in this hand, I think there's a general principe that applies also to NL Cash games. I got a big discussion with one of my friend concerning is preflop action so I would like if you could comment it...

So... This is a home game with 5K starting chips and blinds of 25/50 to starts and each level is 25minutes. We were 13 to start and now were 9 players. 3 places are paid. Blinds are now 75/150. You have a tight image. You are on the BB and get KK.

UTG limp, UTG+1 limp, Button limp, SB calls...

All the players in the hand are good players, all are constant winning online players.

UTG is tight. 4K
UTG+1 is medium loose. 5K
Button is loose. Big stack with 15K
SB is medium loose. 7K

So you get KK on the BB and there's 750 (150x5) already in the pot with my blind. You have a stack of 7.5K. How much should you raise?

[myst1]

I'd make it 600-750.

[LuvDemNutz]

I like 750.

[Huskiez]

I would make it 1000 to go.

With 600-750, that will start a rippling effect where everyone will call and everyone then will have odds to break you.

Another advantage is that this will probably isolate you with the looser bigger stacks who will pay you off with marginal holdings.

[elanto]

[ QUOTE ]
I would make it 1000 to go.

With 600-750, that will start a rippling effect where everyone will call and everyone then will have odds to break you.

Another advantage is that this will probably isolate you with the looser bigger stacks who will pay you off with marginal holdings.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree with this, if the BB raises 5XBB most of the players who limped will fold, 5X being 750 which IMO is the best amount to bet here. With 1k youll just be overbetting the pot and probably everyione will fold.but yeah i would raise from 750-1k, I just disagree with ur statement that by rasing 750 everyone is going to call


-anto

[Post-Oak]

I would make it either 1000 or 1150 to go.

The tight UTG limper will either push or fold. That is good for you.

If UTG folds, you will probably get at least one of the loose players to call. Most likely the loose button with 15K will call.

If I make it 1150 and everyone folds, that's just fine with me. What I don't want is to play KK out of position, in a large, multi-handed pot.

Best case scenario is you isolate against one of the loose players, and make him pay a lot to see this flop.

Raising to 1000+ looks like the best option to me. I would make it 1150 since it seems most of these players are pretty loose.

[Matt Flynn]

he needs to raise big there. at least the pot. i would raise 1K. too much dead money, you do not want to let someone draw out on you cheaply, and you want to give the button an opportunity to blow his stack.

matt

[mak1277]

Also, with the overbet, you might convince someone that you're just trying to take the pot away from a bunch of limpers, and get them to call with a hand they would never think of calling with otherwise.

[SossMan]

I like the 3x + 1bb for every limper rule. That would make it t1050.

Looks about right. Maybe a little more since you are out of position. t1000-t1200 should be about right. If you think the loose button will call more, by all means, raise to t1500 and isolate him.

[radioheadfan]

Overbet the pot. Make it 1200 to go. You either encourage someone to move all in on you with a likely worse hand, or everyone folds and is left wondering what the **** you had.

By the way, many people make this overbet from the BB with a bunch of limpers with any two cards. Your opponents may think you're one of them....

DO NOT PLAY KK OUT OF POSITION IN A MULTIWAY POT!

OVERBET.