small stakes question

[johnsmith]

i like all the helpful people again don't think i am a pro or i would have sold my car to play already. I am decent enough to play higher stakes than $1-$2 though and was wondering about it. Once again I don't care what you say about my skills. THAT WASN'T THE POINT OF THE POST!!

my question was about other crappy players and their effects on play from micro limits to the lower end of small stakes and all you people who keep saying that crap about "good cards" and "I'm not as good as I think I am" I am just wondering what is the point. All I am saying is that I DEFINITELY am not a beginner and am trying to learn. If you just want to talk about how my skills lack or whatever don't even post please. I'm trying to learn and ask advice and that had nothing to do with my post.

[Joe Tall]

I assume you meant my first reply.

I did. Actually, my first response was different but then I read your first reply and had a quick change of heart. Often, I think all you should stick to the 2+2 'rub' and let them have it. It set me straight.


My original response:
I routinely play in a 20/40 game that sees 5 to the flop. Any-two suited, Any-ace, any piece of the board head to the river. PM me your email/phone number and I'll help you make this move up.

Welcome to the forum,
Joe Tall

[bdk3clash]

Seriously, play whatever limit you're comfortable with. It really doesn't matter, but you're likely moving up for the wrong reasons.

If you have more specific questions, fire away, because I'm not going to reread the other stuff you wrote. It's all been responded to effectively enough in this thread and many, many others.

[bernie]

Chesspain and others are dead on for the most part, imo. You say you aren't asking for a skill evaluation. Your comments throughout this thread are reflective of your skill level and understanding of the game. Not to mention your resistance to set your ego aside and really look into your own game and what many other responders are talking about.

Ok, we read many times, you're good enough. Of course you are. Everyone is. Just ask everyone in a cardroom if they're winning players. 4 mos. Wow. You're an old hand at this.

We see this type of post all the time. It's gotta be the game, right? What makes you think 'betwise' that it will be more profitable to move up? Monetarily, yes, if you're good, but not betwise. Betwise, your gain tends to go down.

[ QUOTE ]
Anyway, I play $.50-$1 and $1-$2 limit holdem and although I do o.k. it seems like I am getting sucked out on alot more than even is stated that will happen in SSHE by people playing the absolute stupidest crap. I make good $$$$ when this doesn't happen and understand I should be making money by these people playing crap but when 4 or 5 people all take a turn or two doing this to you once or twice each throughout a session it turns your other profitable sessions into minimal gains overall.




[/ QUOTE ]

If you really understood it, there wouldn't be a 'but' in there. This is where others are seeing the hole in your thinking. Minimal gains? How much do you think you should be making? How big of an edge do you really think you have over bad players? Better yet, how big an edge do you think you'll have over 'better' players?

[ QUOTE ]
Should I be saving a bankroll for playing $2-$4 at least, and applying skills or is this not the problem.

[/ QUOTE ]

What your implying here is that you'll get sucked out on less at a higher limit. What else does this line mean? What's the question about applying skills? There is plenty of skill in beating lowly players. You make it sound like it's lottery poker. It isn't. Even though you veil it that you 'know' you want them to chase and call all the way. Im not convinced you really believe that based on your other responses. Especially your 'minimal gains' comment.

But what the hell, move up. After all, who are any of us to put up a caution sign and maybe point you in a 'better' more productive direction. It's not like any of us have been there before at some point.


Good luck. See ya on the 2-4.

b

[johnsmith]

well i read somewhere else that someone's idea of crushing the limit they are at is 2 BB/hr. Well I have that covered and then some so since we AGAIN are back to skill I answered my own question I never asked there. I was referring to the number of suckouts when I asked my question. Again not whether I was good enough to move up but if it would be smarter than playing in the lower levels because of it. People have answered that and I feel it has nothing to do with skills. My QUESTION WAS ANSWERED by someone saying that it does happen just as much at higher levels. That is as simple as it is.

All of you that keep saying it's my skills it isn't. I am not losing money at the levels I am at and again the skills has no factor in my question.

I average plenty more than 2 BB/hr at micro limits so if that is "crushing" games I guess I'm alright at limit but that still has nothing to do with my question. I think someone needs to start a what skill level should I move up levels post because that is not what I intended.

[bdk3clash]

You just can't be very good at limit hold'em and ask the questions you're asking. That's really all there is to it.

[johnsmith]

ok thanks alot for the help

[johnsmith]

i haven't deposited in party since i started playing there on dec 1 and withdrew about 450. Ultimate Bet paid all my bills in November. All holdem. The tournament I won in October paid for bills in October.

jackass i'm letting this post die thanks alot for the help those that had positive input

[bdk3clash]

"jackass i'm letting this post die thanks alot for the help those that had positive input"

I was super-positive in my first response, but since you felt the need to insult me personally I take it all back and you can go fuck yourself.

[ilovemyZ]

I'm usually a lurker on this board, but I think I'll take a crack at this one.

The players on this board are not focused on whether or not you are a winning player currently. They focus on your skills and overall general understanding of poker. The suckouts you experience at the lower limits are natural, and more importantly, expected. In addition, you seem to focus in on your tournament success. While that's all well and good, tournmaents and ring games require different skill sets and they do not generally require the same type of thinking. (A more experienced and well-read 2+2er realizes this.)

In the long term, the more suckouts you experience, the more bets you are making. If you are a 95% favorite before the turn, you're still going to lose 5% of the time. In short, embrace the suckout because it makes you money.

What you have to decide is do you have a sufficient bankroll to move up(usually 300BB, but it also depends on the bankroll you're comfortable with), and are you skilled enough to make more money at the higher level (1.5BB/100 at 2/4 is less than 4BB at 1/2).

Hope you find this useful, and understand why some of the people trying to help are frustrated with your responses.