Misplay of set?

compsolv · #1 12-15-2004, 05:38 PM

I have no reads - just sat down....I felt a bit off balance here - espicially on the river - what do you pros think of my playing in this hand? I must admit - I was surprised to see the UTG lead out on the river after my previous aggression. . .

Thanks in advance for any comments!

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB raises, BB folds, UTG calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, UTG calls, Hero raises, SB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (6.50 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, SB folds, UTG calls.

River: (10.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12.50 BB

MoreWineII · #2 12-15-2004, 05:43 PM

Raise the river. I expect to see 22 or two pair waaaaaaaaaaay more often than a bigger set or runner runner straight given UTG's actions so far.

sfwusc · #3 12-15-2004, 05:49 PM

I call the flop bet.

Calling the flop bet hopefully gets sb to lead out again on the turn. I think the Flop raise says a pair of queens isnt good.

I think the BB in the end would have been the same, but a set with no flush, or open straight draw---i slow play.

Sometimes the slow play bits you, but sometimes pays nicely.

SFWUSC

ZZZ · #4 12-15-2004, 05:49 PM

Looks fine up to the river, though calling on the flop and waiting until the turn to raise is fine too. In fact that would be my recommended line here. It will tend to get more money in the pot, and it won't cause you to win the hand any less.

You have enough hand to throw in another raise (or two!) on the river. UTG could have JT or 99 if he's a bad player I guess, but a two pair hand like KQ is more likely.

ZZZ

ErrantNight · #5 12-15-2004, 05:56 PM

i like the flop raise, although with position you might be able to pull off a turn raise that catches them both. so not a terrible idea. i tend to not get fancy here. sometimes you'll kill a little action sometimes it won't matter much, and other times you'll get c/r on the turn and you'll be happy.

but an easy river raise. what are you afraid of? 99? i think after SB folds UTG is 3-betting you no problem on the turn, where you're guaranteed to call for more (and might cap).

JT is a possible, but unlikely holding. if so, that was a bad turn bet, and not a fantastic call on the flop. i don't think you can give UTG credit for this runner runner monster, either.

i think you're way ahead on this river a vast majority of the time.

MoDOH · #6 12-15-2004, 06:16 PM

I raise this flop almost everytime. A flop raise is good for two reasons.
First of all you are almost guaranteed to get two more bets in. The Turn could get checked through and you will thus miss your oppurtunity to raise. Raise now and get their money in while they are interested.
Second of all a flop raise disguises the strength of your hand. as a flop raise usually means TP with a flop like this. With some luck you will get checkraised on the Turn allowing you to threebet.
The important thing when you play a set fast is that you can´t slow down as fast as you did in this hand. That´s because your opponents will often overplay their two pairs and their turned TP (if it´s an overcard to the flop)

compsolv · #7 12-15-2004, 06:18 PM

As usual - thank you for all of the kick-ass insights!

I was silly on the river with no raise for sure - when UTG lead out - I really did envision JT - without thinking about how unlikely it would actually be.

As you can see below - it turns out UTG was a complete jackass player - confirmed in later hands.

Congrats to all of you that pegged TWO PAIR. Although - you obviously did not think THIS two pair!

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB raises, BB folds, UTG calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (7 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, UTG calls, Hero raises, SB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (6.50 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, SB folds, UTG calls.

River: (10.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12.50 BB

Results in white below: 
UTG has 2h Qc (two pair, queens and twos).
Hero has 5c 5d (three of a kind, fives).
Outcome: Hero wins 12.50 BB.

compsolv · #8 12-15-2004, 06:23 PM

I "felt" like the flop raise was appropriate - thanks for putting into words so well!