The turn brings hope in set form... and much raising

[ErrantNight]

Another from this 3/6 foray a few months back (there were two others I meant to post from then that are just horrendous... a totally misplayed top pair flop on an overcard turn, and a poorly played flush draw... what I'm trying to say was, I played very poorly post-flop and was saved by having a very nice run of cards).

Here's one that I'm less sure about...

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

BB here is bad tricky. Loves to stick around too long and bet at inappropriate times. I would later get a much stronger read on him as a Buddy To Find Later, but at the time (if I remember correctly) that was my impression. UTG is fairly typical, a little too passive (doesn't raise enough before or after the flop). Still don't know much about SB.

Flop: (8 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks.

Missed check raise from some villain? I was a little concerned... I had been prepared to fold to a bet on this flop, and didn't really consider betting, despite my preflop strength. I was a little worried that despite UTG my raise would be seen as a steal attempt (I'd done that at this table a couple times) and I'd get called down with, well, anything.

Turn: (4 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">BB raises</font>, UTG folds, Hero ????

Well I hit my two outer, and everyone's going buck-wild and now there's a flush draw... jam the turn or wait 'til the river?

[edited to change "not a lot of draws" to "a flush draw" because, well, there's clearly a flush draw, and as rubeskiesiesies pointed out... 9-10 just got open ended)

[Rubeskies]

[ QUOTE ]
Well I hit my two outer, and everyone's going buck-wild and there aren't a lot of draws...

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you not see the 3 diamonds on the board?

Also, T9 is open-ended and there are numerous other gutshots. I'd call this draw-heavy.

[Fat Nicky]

I'd 3-bet the turn. With a flush draw out there, if someone caps, you can be sure you're up against a flush, but you have 10 outs at the river.

At the same time, you make someone drawing to the flush pay extra and/or you collect extra bets from someone you are way ahead of.

[ErrantNight]

no, i did... and do... definitely lazy in writing my response to the turn... will revise...

but my question still stands... folding is clearly wrong... is this a calling or raising situation?

[Little Fishy]

easy raise

-little fish

[TripleH68]

It seems there are benefits to both plays and I am not sure you can call one or the other better.

Given you description of BB I would go for the overcall. If SB does not have the flush he is likely drawing dead or very thin. BB would make this play with K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J or even just the K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] so there is no way you can fold to his aggression at any point.

[ErrantNight]

Anyway, I'm out for the day and won't be back 'til later...

hopefully anyone interested in actually responding to the original question ignores this, responds there...




















(an opportunity to not read these and respond to the initial question)











I thought this was a pretty easy raise myself... wanting to charge flush draws, and punish any slow-played sets, pairs, etc., or simply get an over-eager call from something like a weak ace.

Anyway, I raised, and it was folded around... ?