soah turns LAG with no pair

soah · #1 11-23-2004, 10:29 PM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($42.05)
BB ($315.2)
UTG ($104.95)
MP ($114.35)
CO ($81)
Hero ($97.35)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $1.
UTG calls $2, MP calls $2, 1 fold, Hero raises to $8, 2 folds, UTG calls $6, MP calls $6.

Flop: ($27) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, MP checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($27) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG bets $15, MP folds, Hero calls $15.

River: ($57) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $10, Hero raises to $40, UTG folds.

Final Pot: $107
Main Pot: $77, won by Hero.
Pot 2: $30, returned to Hero.

UTG is unknown to me. A short while ago I raised him and another limper from the bb and only he called. Flop was king-high and he insta-folded to my flop bet. That may be the only hand he's seen me get involved with in the brief time he's been at this table.

I'm trying to increase my overall aggression when playing. This includes raising limpers rather than limping behind and turning up the heat when I sense weakness.

I think my play on every street can be questioned. Also not sure about the amount that I raised at the end... felt good when I did it; on paper it looks too small. Obviously the more I raise, the more likely I take down the pot... but the more I lose when I'm called.

I will explain my reasoning for my actions later, but I don't want to taint the responses just yet.

Unarmed · #2 11-23-2004, 11:25 PM

I don't like it because you have no way to know whether your A and J outs are good. 22-88 (ex 33) are very possible holdings for Villain here and the board contains 4 of those cards by the turn. Given the action thus far you could very well be facing a set. Without the A and J outs you're not getting the odds (confirmed by picking up only $10 on the river, which ended up netting you 52-15 pot+implied odds on your turn call) to rep the flush in this case. When the 6 falls on the river thats another card which may have completed opponent's set, and at these limits is he really laying down a set to a runner runner 3 flush board? If the answer is yes, then I don't mind the play I guess.

I think you got lucky and he had 77...

soah · #3 11-24-2004, 02:01 PM

Doesn't seem to be much interest in this hand. =(

Preflop I'm pretty sure I have the best hand, plus I have position, so I raise. Pretty easy.

On the flop there's no way I can sell the idea that I hit something. I'll get called by trashy pairs or worse fairly often. And after that I basically have to give up on the hand unless I catch something. I decide to just check and see how the hand develops. Out of position I'd probably just try to take it down on the flop, but with position I'll be able to make better decisions on later streets.

On the turn the guy could bet out with almost anything. Including plenty of hands worse than ace high. The second player does me a favor and folds. i'm getting 3:1 with position with four outs to a wheel (I can't imagine my opponent has a six, so the wheel should be good almost every time) and six outs to a pretty strong top pair. And I might have the best hand -- his bet size wasn't too inspiring.

I miss on the river but my opponent strings out some flashing lights to draw as much attention as possible to the fact that he absolutely hates his hand. I consider just calling and seeing if ace high is good, but I think if he had absolutely nothing he'd either give up and check, or bluff a lot bigger. It's more likely he has some really trashy pair and really hates the fact that I called on the turn. His $10 bet is some sort of bad blocking bet because he doesn't want to face a bet if he checks. Since my read is that he's not willing to call a normal-sized bet, I go ahead and raise him an amount that I don't think he'll call.

Comments?

Yeti · #4 11-24-2004, 02:14 PM

Only time for a quick reply..

If you're going to play it like this, raise to $45 on the turn. If he calls you are done with the hand.

soko · #5 11-26-2004, 09:02 PM

Yeti I think the 3 flush with the river made the fold. A turn raise im sure would have not have had the same effect.

BigToga · #6 11-27-2004, 09:05 PM

I don't think there's anything wrong with your turn/flop play - he priced you in for a flush draw with a weak bet and you played the scare cards as outs. Well done. When you didn't bet the flop, you're telling people that you have a drawing hand and you played it through perfectly.

If this were me, I probably bet the flop to represent the high pair and take it down right then. If I get called by trashy pairs and nothing hits the turn, I'll go from there but I'm definitely putting in a $20+ bet on the flop. If I get raised when I bet the flop, I'm done with the hand (absent of other reads).

soah · #7 11-27-2004, 09:56 PM

Just to clarify - I didn't raise the river because it was a spade. I raised because his bet was extremely weak. Now, it's possible that the spade scared him and that's what caused him to bet weakly... who knows. If he bets anything over $20 I insta-fold.

I'll frequently bet those flops against two opponents but I feel like against certain players I am throwing away money. Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I feel that many LAG players will call me on those flops just to steal from me if I blink on the turn. So I don't really know where I'm at when I get called. So yeah, I give up information on my hand when I check the flop, but no more than I give up by betting the flop and checking the turn. I think right now I'm just rambling with no point, so I'll shut up.