Splitting the forum?

[Lloyd]

Anybody have an opinion on splitting the forum based on the buy-in amount? Something like small stakes vs. medium/large stakes? Obviously the advice for a $5 MTT is very different from a Party Super or larger on-land event. It just seems like I've been reading way too many posts from people giving advice at levels that they don't play at. It can be very confusing unless you know the history of the player. And this doesn't just apply to $5 players posting in higher buy-in posts. It goes both ways.

[zaxx19]

WOW THIS IS GREAT ADVICE. IVE POINTED OUT SEVERAL TIMES THERE ARE SOME ARGUEMENTS THAT PLAYERS ARE HAVING ON HERE WERE BOTH PLAYERS MIGHT BE CORRECT GIVEN DIFFERENT LIMITS. OF COURSE USUALLY I AM SUMMARILY FLAMMED AND CALLED WEAK-TIGHT OR JUST MADE FUN OF... [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

[Chief911]

I think there certienly could be some merit to splitting. But I think that's only really needed if a forum is getting flooded with posts at such a rate that one cannot keep up. I'm not sure this forum is there yet.

p.s. Zaxx, is your CAPS key stuck? Can we all pass the hat to send you a new keyboard where it is not stuck?

[zaxx19]

No it isnt....HUSKERS SUCK...passive aggressive messaging rules.

[Chief911]

That's your most accurate post yet! Huskers do suck. =/

[loffe]

From a pure "reader-point-of-view", as you can see this is my first post, I must say that I like it as it is, and I think it benefits the people playing small stake games, like myself, to have you big boys around.

If there was a high stake forum, I could imagine that a lot of the experience some oy the "old guys" have from MTTs would never be passed on to guys like myself. (Apart from that, I must say that I find it very entertaining to read about the big tourneys I don´t play myself)

That said, I do understand the difficulties of sometimes discussing apples and oranges.....

Well, maybe its just me - nevertheless thank you all for a great place to spend half a working day.

Claus

[zaxx19]

Let me ask you guys a question. What limits do you guys regularly play at? The reason I ask is bc it seems at higher levels NLH poker become like an educated mathematical game of roulette combined with chicken. Perhaps good NLH play is always like this and im just naive for expecting anything else?? The way alot of posters on here describe it- Aggression , aggression and then a little bit more aggression. Doesnt even seem like alot of the players like to play flops much; other than moving-in or checkraising all-in. This certainly might be the best way too play in a tourney full of other hyper-aggressive players. Just seems to take alot of fun out of the game. Maybe this is why alot of excellent players play omaha and hi-lo games now. At a certain point doesnt it basically return to a game of pure chance when people are moving in and showing down 77 and aj constantly??

[jackdaniels]

I usually look at the number of posts one made and temper their advice with that. Alas, I've recently learned that people post all over the forum and may not have that much expertise in the CURRENT discussion. Some posters you get to know and respect their advice, others must still prove themselves - by giving good advice regularly that is corroborated by posters we respect and listen to. With that, I would ask that the forum NOT be split at this point. It would be better that readers use their own judgement to see if a particular situation applies to their game or not. As a rule, I wouldn't take any advice as gospel and begin to use it religiously, without first making sure it is sound, tried tested and true.

BTW - Thanks for all the posts, this place has improved my game significantly.

[Lurshy]

I don't think splitting the forum is a good idea.

- While I often may be person that mostly plays at lower buy-ins, I certainly appreciate the advice and knowledge of those who more regularly play at the higher buy-ins.

- This may be naive, but once you are in a tourney, play should mostly be dictated by cards, position, people, stacks and payout structure not buy-in.

- If there was a higher buy-in forum, I think the cutoff s/b more at the mega level 2000$+, there isn't enough difference between a 30$ buyh-in and a 200 buy-in - IMHO.

- If there was a forum split, I would probably be surfing and posting in both in both anyway. How do you police that?


My Poker Background (and I think I fairly typical):

I've been playing on-line for about 3 years, the 1st year being play money.

Got my start with real money, by winning and placing 3rd in two large field freerolls on Paradise when they were runnin their tournament Beta's.

Parlayed that inital BR into about 5000$ mostly by playing ring games up to 5-10 limit.

While doing this, I would continue to play low buy-in tourneys (5-30) some with rebuys, and sats for bigger tourneys. I would occasionally play in the higher buy-in tourney's via the sats.

My tourney results: I've had 6 payouts > 700$ This represents 1-3 place at various buy-ins. I've never had a payout > 900$. I've had a similar number of final table where the money was not as significant, and many in money showings where you essentially get you buy-in back.

However, due to variance, I've reached a point where my ring-game earnings do not support the tourney buy-ins, and my bankroll has shrunk significantly in the last 6 months since peaking last spring. And while I've played in hundreds of MTT tourneys, I haven't played in the thousands necessary to really determine a tourney win rate. Nor have I won with a payout large enough to really support regular attempts at higher buy-ins.

Recently I have begun playing on Party. Mostly SNGs and low buy-in tourney's. I have yet to Money in a Party MTT in 8 attempts [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

In my infrequent visits to Live rooms (Trop in AC, Mohegan Sun (when open), Foxwoods) I have done extraordinary well in limit ring games. Mostly at the 4-8 level.

I have been essentially un-employed for the last two years, so I have spent more time on-line than I should (averaging >500 hands a day for several periods of time). I made significant cash prior to that so I've still been enjoying life though my overall net value has diminished as well.

I have read several books on Poker. Lurked here for 5 months, before starting to post about 6 months ago. I want to improve, and play higher limits as my BR allows.

Now for a bit of a segway to answer what Zaxx's percieves as 'Weak Tight Insults'

Like many, I believe keys to success are a Tight Aggressive style, though I sometimes find myself playing weak tight or loose aggressive either by circumstance or design. I need to improve my understanding of the mathematics behind decision making, though I believe I have a pretty good intuitive feel for it.

My take of your style: You have a genuine understanding of the inherrent weakness of many hands, but you give too much credit to what the other guy may have, and are too worried about survival. Weak Tight

The other guy is oftened as scared by what appeared on the flop as you are. A bet may take it down. That doesn't mean push though it may. While it is true that 'you need a better hand to call or to reraise than you do to bet', just because someone ahead of you bet and you missed doesn't mean you get out of their way - though it may.

Playing Weak Tight is a style, it is not an insult. Those players typically need to have geniune hands to win. They require good starting hands, and may require improvement to continue. If they bet, they often get respect, and this could lead to semi-bluffing opportunities as you change gears to more aggressision. The down side is, aggressive players can push them off of hands when the weak player was really ahead. Weak tight avoids losing with a 2nd best hand, but gives up winning sometimes as well.

Playing Loose Aggressive is also a style not an insult. These players have lower opening standards than others, and will often raise or reraise without the goods, costing you more than you are willing in order to play. They will pay you off, when you have the goods, because they may make a move at the wrong time. They also get good cards like anyone else, and hit unusual hands that you wouldn't have played so you may not put them on it. Therefore, it can cost you dearly if you play back at the wrong time.

Tight Aggressive players require good opening hands to open. They often will continue to press even if they missed the flop - representing another premium hand on the board, or trusting the other guy missed as well - taking advantage of the doubt in the other guy. They don't see many flops. At showdowns, because they often do have a premium hand, they continue to get image which they can use in semi-bluff opporunities. They can get caught bluffing though and pay-off, and though they often have a good hand, they may not have the nuts (this may pay-off as well).

Loose Passive - Again a style not an insult. These people like to see flops cheap. May chase by calling, but rarely lead out unless they hit. Even if they do hit, They can take advantage of their calling station image by checking and hoping to trap an aggressive player betting along the way. Be wary of value betting the river against a loose passive player if you don't have the nuts. They sometime hit, costing that guy who pressed his AA to go on tilt.

I believe good players take advantage of all of these styles at different times. Locking yourself into one method won't work. That said, many start out wanting to go the TAG path - Playing premium starting hands, playing them aggressively, hopefully knowing when to stop pressing though.

I think you also need to understand that the hands you see posted here are the 'close decisions' The good players here do make many laydowns. They may fold to raises preflop or post flop with what appears to be good starting hands to many newbies, you rarely see those hands posted though. As a matter of fact you more often see the situation posted where the wrong decision was made (whether it worked out or not, and whether or not it was the hero that made the 'wrong' decision), or the correct decision was made, and it didn't work out.

Sorry for the long - slightly off topic post. But I do ramble at times.

- Lurshy

If there is one thing I wish to be separated from this forum is the so called "Official what's-its-name tourney" that are cluttered with umpteen meaningless posts, like: :I'm In, may name is Joblo. Who else"; "Busted 3050th, no cards", etc. etc." To me, these are like spams that unnecessarily bury the real insightful, educational posts that seasoned veterans unselfishly share with us.

We already have "The Zoo". Maybe they call this "The Aquarium".

Matt, I hope you read this.