Did I mis play this hand

WSOP Bound · #1 11-13-2004, 11:18 PM

I'm sure that I misplayed this hand, but the question is where and how badly? UTG+1 has VP$IP of 68.18 and an aggression factor of 2.1 after 52 hands.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 folds, CO calls, Button raises, SB folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds, CO calls, Button calls.

Flop: (13.50 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, CO calls, Button calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (10.75 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, CO calls, Button calls, Hero raises, UTG+1 3-bets, CO calls, Button calls, Hero calls.

River: (22.75 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, CO calls, Button calls, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 caps, CO folds, Button calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 36.75 BB
Main Pot: 36.75 BB, between Button, Hero and UTG+1.

fairness · #2 11-13-2004, 11:34 PM

i would probably fold this preflop, i definitely wouldn't 3 bet it preflop. calling would be ok if it was KQ suited. KQ offsuit is a good hand against opponents with weak hands but its EV plummets against a pf raiser. also really don't like the check/raise on the turn. you should have 3 bet the flop to see whether UTG would cap it. if he caps it then check/fold the turn. if he just calls, lead out on the turn. im guessing 99 for UTG,

Ajax410 · #3 11-14-2004, 12:13 AM

I think the pre-flop raise is too aggressive - but I think a call is definitly okay - considering the fact that you're only paying an extra small bet to see the flop.

Granted that your villain has shown aggression - a 2.1 AF isn't totally high, and doesn't justify your turn check/raise.

I think I 3-bet the flop, if he caps, I call down. Also, keep in mind that the pre-flop raiser is sticking around, so it's likely that he has a hand that might even trump your 888QQ hand.

Personally, I'd be much more wary of the button's sticking around the entire time - what is your read on him? AA or KK seem like hands that I'd be playing the way he's playing here...but that's just a thought.

Just to clarify - I don't think I would actually play AA or KK like this, but I do think that passive players tend to see monsters when they're holding monsters - so it's not a line I wouldn't expect from AA or KK in the micros.

Alex

zuluking · #4 11-14-2004, 12:13 AM

The pre-flop re-raise depends on the button, I don't think that folding here is best. Re-raise and cap the flop. Bet out on the turn and check/call to the river.

WSOP Bound · #5 11-14-2004, 12:28 AM

Button was tilting on two bad beats from UTG+1 about 15 hands back. I didn't feel that Button's raises indicated that I was facing a premium hand. I felt that althought I would be out of position the raise could put me heads up against him.

The turn check-raise was a bad judgement call.

fairness · #6 11-14-2004, 02:39 AM

next time post any reads on your opponents before the hand, makes it easier to understand where your decisions are coming from.

Shillx · #7 11-14-2004, 05:41 AM

Yeah this is a comedy of errors IMO.
I would fold pre-flop, but I can understand calling.
Even after you 3-bet preflop, you need to c/r the flop. When you bet, it is just too likely that everyone will take one off agasint you.
The turn check/raise is counter-productive as you are trapping people for big bets with a hand that needs protection. I would stop and go on the turn given the action. The river bet is questionable given the action (UTG+1 is representing something like 99 or 98 or JT on the turn), but the 3-bet is just spewing IMO.

Brad

Aaron W. · #8 11-14-2004, 12:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The pre-flop re-raise depends on the button, I don't think that folding here is best. Re-raise and cap the flop. Bet out on the turn and check/call to the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the flop re-raise depends much more on the limpers. The only reason you would want to raise in this spot with that hand is to try to isolate an agressive player (since QJo is not a hand to raise for value). But if you can't get the other hands to fold, you're just wasting money putting in lots of bets out of position with a marinal to weak hand.

Since it turns out he was tilting, a call would have been fine, but folding is also reasonable.

nothumb · #9 11-14-2004, 04:15 PM

I would just call pre-flop. Even if he's tilting, outplay him postflop and see this cheaply.

On the flop, I think you go for a check-raise. Having not 3-bet preflop, you could expect to get a bet from late position. Given your play I still lean towards a check-raise, although if I had known UTG+1 would raise, I would bet out.

Turn, I would bet out again.

River, I'd bet again, thinking UTG probably has a Q. I wouldn't 3-bet.

NT

WSOP Bound · #10 11-14-2004, 05:44 PM

Thank you everyone for your feedback. It seems that I made a mistake by overvaluing my hand preflop even against weak/tilting opponents. Then I didn't put in the small bets on the flop where I could have figured out cheaply where I stood. The check-raise on the turn is just somtehing that I have no idea what I was thinking.

I have so much to learn, but thanks for helping me with the process.