big pot, so-so hand

[DanK]

20-40 live. Ok I definatley messed this one up, multiple times, and would like to c what you guys think.

solid UTG+1 limps, loos calling stating limps behind, solid player CO-1 raises, I 3bet with red 99 on the button loos BB calls, everyone calls.

Flop: 10s 8s 5s

Checked to CO-1 who bets, I raise all call except for BB.

Turn: 4d

checked to me, I bet all call (co-1 thought for a while about folding)

River: blank (cant remember but not a spade or overcard)

checked to me, I check.

Well basicly, what I SHOULD have done was wait till the turn to raise, i think(?). Anyway any input will be apreciated.

[DrGutshot]

sure it seems tempting to wait until the turn to raise here...but there are so many cards you don't want to see that raising this flop is clearly best. Betting the turn blank is no question as well. Checking behind the river seems standard to me.

In other words, I play this exactly the same.

-DrG

[bicyclekick]

How about cold-call pre-flop and I dont think it's close. It's not an absolultely HORRIBLE play, but calling is by far the best choice.

Curiously, why did you raise. CO-1 had JJ or QQ didn't he. Don't bet the river, he'll call you.

[KowCiller]

[ QUOTE ]
but there are so many cards you don't want to see that raising this flop is clearly best.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is precisely the reason to wait until the turn to raise, according to SSH. Ed Miller talks about passing on possible small edges for much greater edges on a later street. 99 is a hand here that has a good chance to be best on the flop, and with a large pot no one is going to get out for 2 cold on the flop (and they probably shouldn't, even with many weak draws). Waiting for a "safe" card on the turn gives you a much bigger edge as well as likely forcing people out with 2 big bets.

Am I correct or have I misapplied this principle?

KoW

[hockey1]

[ QUOTE ]
20-40 live. Ok I definatley messed this one up, multiple times, and would like to c what you guys think.

solid UTG+1 limps, loos calling stating limps behind, solid player CO-1 raises, I 3bet with red 99 on the button loos BB calls, everyone calls.

Flop: 10s 8s 5s

Checked to CO-1 who bets, I raise all call except for BB.

Turn: 4d

checked to me, I bet all call (co-1 thought for a while about folding)

River: blank (cant remember but not a spade or overcard)

checked to me, I check.

Well basicly, what I SHOULD have done was wait till the turn to raise, i think(?). Anyway any input will be apreciated.

[/ QUOTE ]

Preflop: Calling is probably better than raising. You're not going to clear the field enough with a 3-bet here, so play for the set or a really favorable (little rainbow) flop.

Flop: Oh well, too bad, an overcard and monotone, with none of your suit, four opponents. Maybe next . . . you WHAT? wtf? It's 99 not AA. IF you are ahead you're facing SEVERE negative implied odds. If you're not ahead you have exactly one clean out -- and your opponents have re-draws. This is a very easy fold. If you're going to play on it's hard to say whether raising or calling is better. I guess just calling since it puts the least $$ into what in the vast majority of hands is a completely lost cause.

Turn: Since you raised you might as well bet and hope all 4 are on overcards or flush draws.

River: Checking is right.

[JasonP530]

When 4 people cold call my raise on the flop, I would check the turn. No way youre ahead here.