Cutting my sessions short

[Ponks]

Hey all,

I figured this is the appropriate forum for my topic as I've read a little of some of the Psychology books on poker. In them it explains that you shouldn't end your session short for various reasons, especially if the game is good. I understand why this is so and pretty much everything about it, I think. )Play for the long-run yadda yadda)

However, I am constantly ending my sessions short. I am all too happy to book a modest win for the session/day. If I'm about break-even or losing sometimes I'll quit after winning a decent pot.

Some background on me:

I'm a 19 year old college student (majoring in Psychology). I've been playing poker for about 8-9 months online now (learned how to play hold'em about 9-10 months ago). I'm getting pretty good now and I just moved up to 15/30 as I've acquired the 600BB that I've wanted before moving up. I'm pretty risk-aversive (I also play extremely tight, inbetween 11-13 VPIP with 8-9 PFR, with a very low SD), but still decided to play 15/30 and figure I can beat the game. So far I've only about 6,000 hands there (I know that's nothing) with a +1.50bb/100, 4-tabling. At 3/6 I had about 80k hands 8 tabling with a winrate of +2.06bb/100.

I really want to play some more hands at 15/30 and get in the hours to see if I'm really a winner, but I just seem to cut my sessions short all the time. It takes me like 10-15 minutes to get 4 tables running smoothly, and then I end up quitting after 45 mins - 1 hour. Any advice to help me get in the hours and lengthen my sessions. I just find myself reading 2+2 constantly instead of playing. I know I need to disconnect myself from the money and continue to play in good games because I expect to make more in the long run, but I just can't push myself to do it. Any advice? Any people in the same boat as me? I really do enjoy playing poker, but I'm having a hard time conquering this hurdle.

This has been going on for weeks now (maybe even longer) and it's frustrating for me to only play for an hour. I'm having a hard time trying to pin-point when this problem started. Mostly at 15/30, but I know at 3/6 I was happy to book some wins too, but playing 8 tables just kinda kept me going and not thinking about it as much. (I dont think I'm ready to 8-table the 15/30 either :/ )

Thanks
Ponks

[Ponks]

I just wanted to point out that I'm not really doing hit and runs. I think I'm just more apprehensive about moving up limits. I dont know if I can beat the game and I dont want to lose a big chunk of my bankroll to find out. So I end up playing a lot less, but I need to get in more hands to figure out my winrate. It's a vicious cycle and I can't get past it.

Ponks

[joedot]

You're afraid to lose. It's not about the amounts won or lost, it's the idea of losing that strikes fear in your heart. You want that good feeling that comes with winning, and you want to avoid that horrible knot in your stomach that comes with losing. 15/30 exacerbates this fear of yours, because you realize that a loss here would be of bigger magnitude and would cause those feelings in a more intense way. I have the same problem, and I've been doing this successfully for a living for 2 years now. I quit when I hit my daily quota quite often. The biggest problem with doing this is that you could be leaving money on the table, and you may get more frustrated when you don't win your money as quickly as you would like on those tough days (and frustration can lead to a whole bunch of other nasty things). There are positives too though. It cretes a lot of confidence to book winners, and confidence is very important to your poker game. It allows you to get out and do other fun things with your life. I could go on, but you get the point. Anyway, you're not me, so maybe this doesn't describe your situation exactly, but it is at least something to consider.

[Ponks]

That sounds about right [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Anyway to help change my mentality?? Another reason I hate to lose is that my friends often ask me how I do for the day. If I tell them I'm down $1400 or something they go nuts, and I dont really like that. Should I just lie to my friends or what?

Thanks much,
Ponks

[Cerril]

I had to ramp up my hours. I had similar problems until I looked at a nice chunk of hands (a couple thousand or close to ten thousand) and though 'you know, if that's actually an accurate winrate [and you know that cutting your sessions short didn't boost it artificially, at least], then I've only been hurting myself by playing less.' At that point it starts becoming easier to risk a losing session or to keep playing after you've been playing.

The second reason that's helpful is that with a larger bankroll (or at least with a solid 'amount won' column) it's easier to look at a larger loss and go 'eh, just a normal swing.'

[Blarg]

I have the same problem as you and joedots quite often.

I played live stud at the 10/20 and 15/30 level profitably for a couple of years, and was a highly respected player by the regulars. I felt I had a decent competence in the game, and a pretty good ability to spot my mistakes.

In hold'em I'm having much more difficulty exhibiting real competence. There's something about the game that just doesn't click as readily with me, I think. Still, my game has improved, but I think I'm much more gun-shy about playing it and find it hard to get in the hours sometimes.

Joedot and your observation in your last paragraph points out that the level has a lot to do with it. I find that myself. I'm extremely risk averse, because I haven't built up a long enough winning record to be comfortable. The swings affect me too much. You say you could go along fine on 3/6, but now that you've moved up, your story is different. The money is money now, not chips anymore.

It sounds like you're probably going to need plenty of hands played before that changes. Hard to do when you're gun-shy, but there's no other way to get those numbers except like playing, so it's like the negatives reinforce themselves.

On the other hand, maybe the positives can reinforce themselves too, if you give them a chance. I think just playing a lot of hands is the only way for that to happen. The results could be negative or mediocre, but you can't build confidence if you don't play.

If the level is too hard for you to gain confidence at, you might just be better off staying at a slightly lower level for a good long time, until you're deeply convinced that you deserve to be at the level you want to be at.

[Ponks]

I agree with you that I just need to suck it up and play. I think I'm going to avoid telling other people my results. When my friends ask maybe I'll just say I didnt play or something. I'm going to try to be totally honest with myself and just try to get up to 20k hands and not pay attention to the results. I've even though of putting tape over how much money I have at the tables and the cashier so I wouldn't be constantly checking whether I'm up or down or whatever.

Has anyone ever done anything like that?

Also, I think 15/30 is the only real step for me. I've played 3/6 for approx 3-4 months for 80k hands. I enjoyed it a lot, but I only played there to build up my bankroll to $18,000 (600bb) for the 15/30 game. I played 5/10 for 20k hands and made $32 total over the course of 3 weeks or so. I didnt really like the 5/10 game, seemed like a rock garden to me, and that's not that fun to me. I'm ready for 15/30 except that I'm afraid to lose. I did play 300 hands today though, so that's good, hopefully I'll get in another 250+ hands later today 4-tabling. That's only an hour, but it's better then nothing I guess.

Thanks
Ponks

[Peter Harris]

i admire how fast you people work. I'm 21, have only played 7500 hands at .5/1 and 2700 at 1/2 in the past 10 months, and see you people getting vertigo at 15/30.

I wonder if slow and steady really does win the race...

Regards,
Pete Harris

[chesspain]

If you readily admit that you are afraid of losing serious money, then why are you playing four tables at once? Why don't you just play one or two tables, and then after you feel confident and unafraid of losing you can slowly begin to add tables.

[BugSplatt]

Wouldn't it be a natural progression to play the 10/20 tables before moving to 15/30? I think it would help you mentally prepare for the step up to 15/30.

Bug