10/20 Party, Missed bets w/ QQ?

I Play 2 Ski · #1 10-03-2004, 09:48 AM

This was my first attmpt at playing 10/20,which is a big jump from 5/10 for me so I am curious if I played this correctly. I am fairly sure I played this too weak, but with 4 people I was putting one of them, mistakingly on a set. Let me have it...

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, Hero raises, MP2 calls, MP3 3-bets, CO calls, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (18.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO raises, BB folds, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (13.25 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, CO bets, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP3 calls.

River: (17.25 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks, MP3 checks, CO bets, UTG calls, Hero calls, MP3 folds.

Final Pot: 20.25 BB

Results in white below: 
UTG has Ts Tc (two pair, tens and threes).
Hero has Qh Qc (two pair, queens and threes).
CO has 5h 6h (two pair, sixes and threes).
Outcome: Hero wins 20.25 BB.

Poker_pete · #2 10-03-2004, 10:26 AM

There is nothing wrong with the way you played it. I would have been more worried abobtweut AA or KK.

BTW - Love your screen name. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

I Play 2 Ski · #3 10-03-2004, 10:44 AM

Lost of skiiers on this board. check out epicski.com, if you haven't already

sthief09 · #4 10-03-2004, 10:57 AM

No offense, but I think you could probably use some more work at the lower limits unless your bankroll is huge. You played this hand really weak-tight and in the aggressive online games, you'll get killed playing like this.

first of all, not capping with QQ is a crime unless you have some specific read saying that the guy only 3-bets with AA or KK. You're against 6 people and you have the best hand 95% of the time. Cap it up.

On the flop, in such a huge pot, you're not going to be able to protect your hand by 3-betting. That leaves you with 2 choices. you can 3-bet the flop, choosing to pump the pot, since your equity is big, that is, there are 3 SB being put in the pot for every 1 SB you put in. you're going to win far more than 25% (1/4) here, so it would be profitable to go nuts and pump the pot. You can also way for the turn to check-raise. You'll make more money since the bets have doubled, but there's a risk you don't have the best hand, and a small chance that the CO will check the turn through.

Overall, I think these options are pretty close, but I'd probably 3-bet the flop and lead the turn. Sometimes the CO will smooth call the flop and pop you on the turn, but oh well.

sthief09 · #5 10-03-2004, 10:58 AM

did you even read the hand?

steveyz · #6 10-03-2004, 11:30 AM

I think you have to either 3-bet this flop or check raise the turn. CO's play looking nothing like a set. A pre-flop 3-bet cold call and raise on a rag flop looks a lot like TT/99. Most people would wait until the turn to raise with a set. Certainly looks like MP3 has AK here. A flop 3-bet or turn check-raise probably gets him to lay it down, thus protecting your hand.

steveyz · #7 10-03-2004, 11:33 AM

I've never seen AA or KK cold call 3-bets preflop then raise the flop. If they are gonna try to trap, they almost always wait until the turn. Most of the time they will cap pre-flop as in this multi-way situation, you lose a lot of value pre-flop by not capping AA/KK and even capping QQ, which is what hero should have done.

I Play 2 Ski · #8 10-03-2004, 12:27 PM

Youre absolutely right, this was in my first orbit and I wasn't expecting such loose action...now I know better [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

surfdoc · #9 10-03-2004, 02:37 PM

I don't think failing to cap is as big a mistake as the rest of the hand. You have a lot of options here all of which are better than the way you played it.

As others have stated, you can 3 bet the flop and lead the turn, or CR the turn. I think there is another option here that is reasonable. You got a caller behind you, then 3 bet and the CO called 3 cold. There is zero chance that none of these guys will bet the flop. So, given your early position, a CR on the flop is also not a bad play to try and protect your hand and push out anyone who may beat you when an overcard comes. I prefer the flop 3 bet but there are really 3 options.

The flop CR also has the added effect of sending the message that they can't put you on overcards anytime you raise and then check the flop. Of course this reason is not that vital becuase these goofs won't be paying attention. This is more important in a live game me thinks.

bicyclekick · #10 10-03-2004, 03:02 PM

i haven't read the other posts, but here is how I play is -

A while ago I woulda never capped, but lately after being tought some nice stuff in a post I made, I'd cap it.

On the flop, I'd 3 bet. If he caps I fire another bullet on the turn baring an ace or king if mp3 came along and call down a raise.

I Don't think you played it awefully, esp if it was a lower limit game, but when you get higher up in limits other players are going to be very aggressive and often overplay their hand and you have to make them pay for it.