What would you do?

[Nick B.]

[ QUOTE ]
Being a below average player, I re-raised to a total of 16,000T. My thoughts were: He probably has 66-AA or AK outside shot AQ. This player is solid, but has shown a tendency to be a LAG. I thought I could push him off 66-maybe JJ and quite possibly AK and AQ.

After my raise, he exhibited his major tell and then I knew he had J's or better. He called.

The Flop is 10 6 2

He checks.

What do you do??

[/ QUOTE ]

Why raise more than half your stack? If you are going to raise, it is all in. I would most likely fold this though since you are still in ep and the raiser is UTG, you should give him a little respect.

[Jason Strasser]

Yuck my lord there is some truly awful advice in this thread.

1) Just because he raised UTG doesnt usually mean he only has AA-JJ.

2) When someone raises PF UTG then checks the flop, you really need some sort of read to have any idea what he has. A tricky player may be slow playing, or giving up. A weak player could be giving up. It's tough to know.

3) Regardless of what your opponent has, I would think checking through on the flop is a horrible move against an average opponent. Sure the line he took is very strange, and worthy of suspicion--but please. You have 2 over-cards and the nut flush, and you could be ahead at the moment (or get your opponent to fold a small pocket pair). If you get raised, you are never going to be a huge dog, and will almost always be a coinflip or a slight favorite.

Why do you check behind? If you are the type to check behind, then fold to a blank on the turn, then don't call this raise preflop. A hand like this loses a lot of value on the turn most of the time. You want to get your money in on the flop when:

a) your hand has the most value
b) you have more folding equity because the pot is smaller

The preflop play is very opponent dependant. I would say that if you have respect for your opponent, calling is silly. Stacks are not very deep, and you could get a caller or raise behind you. However, there are 13 left, so I am assuming you are shorthanded. So I think a lot depends on your opponent in this spot.

Anyhow, just a ramble inspired by some (not from the usual posters) horrible advice in this thread.

-Jason

[Nick B.]

[ QUOTE ]
Yuck my lord there is some truly awful advice in this thread.

1) Just because he raised UTG doesnt usually mean he only has AA-JJ.

2) When someone raises PF UTG then checks the flop, you really need some sort of read to have any idea what he has. A tricky player may be slow playing, or giving up. A weak player could be giving up. It's tough to know.

3) Regardless of what your opponent has, I would think checking through on the flop is a horrible move against an average opponent. Sure the line he took is very strange, and worthy of suspicion--but please. You have 2 over-cards and the nut flush, and you could be ahead at the moment (or get your opponent to fold a small pocket pair). If you get raised, you are never going to be a huge dog, and will almost always be a coinflip or a slight favorite.

Why do you check behind? If you are the type to check behind, then fold to a blank on the turn, then don't call this raise preflop. A hand like this loses a lot of value on the turn most of the time. You want to get your money in on the flop when:

a) your hand has the most value
b) you have more folding equity because the pot is smaller

The preflop play is very opponent dependant. I would say that if you have respect for your opponent, calling is silly. Stacks are not very deep, and you could get a caller or raise behind you. However, there are 13 left, so I am assuming you are shorthanded. So I think a lot depends on your opponent in this spot.

Anyhow, just a ramble inspired by some (not from the usual posters) horrible advice in this thread.

-Jason

[/ QUOTE ]

If you read the entire thread you would note that he Reraised UTG to 16,000.

[cowpie]

[ QUOTE ]
Yuck my lord there is some truly awful advice in this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just read yours and you didn't even read his analysis of the hand, so your advice is useless. Thanks for another awful advice.

[ QUOTE ]
1) Just because he raised UTG doesnt usually mean he only has AA-JJ.

[/ QUOTE ]

texaspimp said that UTG had a tell where he knew UTG had JJ-AA. He did not say he thought UTG had JJ-AA because he raised UTG.

[ QUOTE ]
Anyhow, just a ramble inspired by some (not from the usual posters) horrible advice in this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for your truly fantastic advice. Next time, read all of his replies before calling all of us idiots.

[Sam T.]

If you KNOW he's got JJ or better, the only option is to check.

It seems unlikely he's going to fold an overpair here, so betting won't win you the hand. More importantly, if he's got the overpair, he is undoubtedly going for a check-raise.

I think this is a FTOP issue - if he showed you rockets or cowboys and then checked, what would you do?

P.S. Give Jason a break. He's a hero.

[cowpie]

[ QUOTE ]
P.S. Give Jason a break. He's a hero.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sorry, I didn't know he was a hero. Forgive me Jason.

[texaspimp]

I didn't mean to cause such rancor!!

I decided to push at this point for a couple of reasons:

(Please keep in mind I admitted I am a below average player and I am trying to get better via your advice!)

1) His stack is very comparable to mine. My thoughts were pushing here would make him put me on a set or AA, KK, etc.

2) I figured at this point I had between 10 and 14 outs, which would put me about 55-45 dog. The flush, the A's and way outside chance of runner-runner Q.

3) Being the aggressor, I thought I had some fold equity with him. I was wrong!


As you can imagine, he insta-called and turned over the cowboys.

Blank turn, blank river, ballgame.

I sincerely appreciate all advice!