Foolish laydown

[dethgrind]

So I made what I think was a huge mistake a couple days ago. I'll summarize what is below: 9 players remain with blinds at lvl 2, I limp in EP with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2 others limp, SB completes, BB checks. 5-way flop with 150 in the pot. Flop comes J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Blinds check to me, I bet the pot, all call except the BB. 4-way, pot is 750, turn comes 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], SB checks, I have 950 left, bet 350, get raised to 700, one player folds, SB calls all-in, I fold. River comes 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], raiser shows A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], SB shows 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], raiser takes it down with a pair of eights.

The flop bet seems pretty standard, but perhaps I should have overbet it a bet. Do you agree with the turn bet? Clearly in this case the fold was a terrible mistake, but in general is it so bad? Should I have bet more, or possible moved in? If the bet was correct, should I have moved in after getting raised? I'd appreciate any comments that don't make fun of me [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

No-limit Texas Hold'em $20+$2 (real money)

Seat 1: ALLANP ($1,975 in chips)
Seat 2: jacktwo ($855 in chips)
Seat 4: buzzboyzz ($2,535 in chips)
Seat 5: bulldog050 ($1,900 in chips)
Seat 6: woty43 ($2,010 in chips)
Seat 7: HERO [ JS,AD ] ($1,130 in chips)
Seat 8: austin1072 ($1,765 in chips)
Seat 9: hwood33 ($1,578 in chips)
Seat 10: reid a. ($1,252 in chips)

ANTES/BLINDS
jacktwo posts blind ($15), buzzboyzz posts blind ($30).

PRE-FLOP
bulldog050 folds, woty43 folds, HERO calls $30, austin1072 calls $30, hwood33 calls $30, reid a. folds, ALLANP folds, jacktwo calls $15, buzzboyzz checks.

FLOP [board cards JD,3H,2D ]
jacktwo checks, buzzboyzz checks, HERO bets $150, austin1072 calls $150, hwood33 calls $150, jacktwo calls $150, buzzboyzz folds.

TURN [board cards JD,3H,2D,5H ]
jacktwo checks, HERO bets $350, austin1072 bets $700, hwood33 folds, jacktwo calls $675 and is all-in, HERO folds.

RIVER [board cards JD,3H,2D,5H,8S ]

SHOWDOWN
austin1072 shows [ 8H,AH ]
jacktwo shows [ 4S,4D ]
austin1072 wins $25, austin1072 wins $2,450.

SUMMARY
Dealer: ALLANP
Pot: $2,475 | Rake: $0
ALLANP loses $0
jacktwo loses $855
buzzboyzz loses $30
bulldog050 loses $0
woty43 loses $0
HERO loses $530
austin1072 bets $880, collects $2,475, net $1,595
hwood33 loses $180
reid a. loses $0

[ddubois]

Use the hand hisotry convertor. Don't include players' user names, instead only reads about their play, in hand histories.

[Tonsafun]

This is my first post of any kind here, so I guess my opinion doesn't carry much weight, but I think your biggest mistake was not making a strong raise preflop. It sounds like the guy you were playing with was a bit of a maniac (the one who moved all in with the A8h), and I'm assuming you knew that. A strong raise, and if he calls it and doesn't hit I would think that he would be more apt to throw it away after the flop. You also would have probably gotten rid of the pocket fours. Honestly, though, playing with idiots like that you would probably have to pull up the skirt and call the all in. They could have anything, and if they had your hand beaten before the flop badly, they would have reraised. But that's just my opinion.

[Sam T.]

A rather chaotic hand, but you helped it get there.
Pre-flop:
I don't like the PF limp. Raise or fold. You don't want to play AJo multi-handed. Get this heads-up PF, and you're in MUCH better shape.

Flop:
Pot bet makes sense to me, though I could be sold on a larger bet. You want to chase Kx and Qx.

Turn:
I'm not sure I like the 350 bet. The rule of thumb I've seen here is that if you're going to bet 35-40% of your stack, you should push. That said, I don't know if a smaller bet would make sense. When the other two players go agro, you are right to be nervous - I would not want to be in the position of calling two all-ins with TPTK. To me this kind of betting screams "Somebody hit their hand!"

[dethgrind]

Good call on the hand converter. Raising with AJo in a 9-handed game preflop in early position is no good IMO, so it seems I should have laid it down. Though from what I've read about limit holdem cash games (a lot), this is often a limping hand. The idea is that against weak opponents, if there's no raise preflop, and the flop comes A or J high, my hand is almost certainly good, which was exactly the case here. A problem with raising is that if you get called and the flop comes A high, you don't know where you stand, and you're out of position. Care to elaborate further on why you prefer raising/folding versus limping?

So I take it you check/fold the turn, or do you push?

[Potowame]

I assume this was on PP, this is normal on that site in low buy-in stuff, which I play mainly.
I had a similar hand, 5 handed all limps me on the BB with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] pot about 75. Flop A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] sb checks, I bet $75 ep folds mp raises 400 lp folds sb calls (puts him all in). What to do with that crap but fold.
Well I had the best hand on the flop with the pair of aces, the idiot in mp had q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]10 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and the sb had 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] . the small blind hit a 5 and won with a str8.
Kinda of pissed and happy lol. PP seems to have 2 or 3 players on every (small) table that try to bluff every hand, either you have the Min bet bluffers or the idiot allin bluffers. You just have to detect that in thier play and give more value to your hands when in pots with them.

[BradleyT]

AJo isn't a strong enough hand to raise from EP. You're in big trouble if you get re-raised.

I barely even play it in EP. It's a major trap hand.