Folding AKo PF

Hood · #1 06-15-2004, 07:24 PM

I'd normally go all in here in a flash, but I think that's a big whole - one I'm trying to fill. Is the the correct play, or too weak?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (10 handed) converter

saw flop|saw showdown

Button (t785)
SB (t785)
BB (t800)
UTG (t1030)
UTG+1 (t785)
UTG+2 (t800)
MP1 (t800)
Hero (t800)
MP3 (t800)
CO (t615)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls t15, UTG+1 raises to t30, UTG+2 folds, MP1 raises to t200, Hero folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls t185, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls t170.

Flop: (t625) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets t100, BB folds, UTG+1 calls t100.

Turn: (t825) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 checks, MP1 bets t100, UTG+1 folds.

Final Pot: t925
Main Pot: t825 (t825), won by MP1.
Pot 2: t100 (t100), returned to MP1.

Results in white below: 
No showdown. MP1 wins t925.

TylerD · #2 06-16-2004, 07:05 AM

If its a low limit buy-in, I'd probably go all-in.

ZeeJustin · #3 06-16-2004, 08:14 AM

Call.

Hood · #4 06-16-2004, 09:12 AM

Thanks for the responses - if you could elaborate a bit more I may understood the reasons why I made an error here.

The reason I didn't go all in is because I was pretty confident I'd get called. That sounds rather weak, but I thought they're be a good chance it would be a call with a pocket pair - in these low limits that would be anything from 22 up to AA. So either I'll be a big dog or a coin flip, neither or which I want to take. I guess could be up against AQ, or even AJ, but I thought that unlikely.

Regarding calling - I did consider this. However a call is 25% of my stack (this is Party T800, I'm used to T1500; that would have been an easier call) which 'violates' the 10% rule. If I called, the PF raises would likely push at me regardless of the flop. If there's no A or K, I'd have to fold it - which is the rather likely.

The other reason I didn't call is I feared a re-raise - I've found early rounds on party rather manic, and a raise from the 6 players behind me, or a re-raise from the first minraiser, seemed quite possible.

Retrospectively, either call/all in would have been better that my fold, what with the ace on the flop and the pathetic play of the players on the flop/turn, but I convinced myself this was 'results orientated'

From reading the forums here, I've learnt not to take chances for a large part of my stack early on when I didn't need to. But perhaps this was too tight.

(edited with bit about results-orientated)

ZeeJustin · #5 06-16-2004, 10:10 AM

[ QUOTE ]
which 'violates' the 10% rule.

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought the 10% rule only referred to pocket pairs? Either way, it's a pretty crappy rule.

soxfan70 · #6 06-16-2004, 10:27 AM

That to me is a pretty weak/tight fold. At the very least you have to call and see the flop with that hand. if it hits rags, and he comes out firing again, then you can probably put him on a PP or maybe even a hand as weak as AK,grin: and lay it down.

Hood · #7 06-16-2004, 11:00 AM

[ QUOTE ]
That to me is a pretty weak/tight fold. At the very least you have to call and see the flop with that hand. if it hits rags, and he comes out firing again, then you can probably put him on a PP or maybe even a hand as weak as AK,grin: and lay it down.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the problem here is with ~450 in the pot when the flop comes, he's going to fire at that pot whatever comes down. I can't tell whether he's got a pocket overpair or not, so I'll have to fold unless an A or K comes down.

Beavis68 · #8 06-16-2004, 12:53 PM

I wouldn't sweat this hand at all, it is still early and you didnt lose any chips on it. Going all-in is reckless, and I think there is too much betting to just call. No need to get knocked out this early, or damage your chip stack on a a drawing hand.

fnurt · #9 06-16-2004, 12:57 PM

The implications of the "10% rule" are that if someone raises to T90 on the first hand of the tourney, your only choices are all-in or fold, because a call would be over 10% of your stack. That strikes me as a bit silly.

BradleyT · #10 06-16-2004, 01:56 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The implications of the "10% rule" are that if someone raises to T90 on the first hand of the tourney, your only choices are all-in or fold, because a call would be over 10% of your stack. That strikes me as a bit silly.

[/ QUOTE ]

How is it silly? Work out the math and you need about 10:1 to flop a set that isn't beat and continue with the hand. If you're calling 20% you're going through your stack twice to double up once.