Another NL hand for review

[Gomez22]

Stars .01/.02

I'm SB with A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, Button calls $.02, I call, BB raises to $.12, Button calls, I call (should I have re-raised here, and if so, by how much?).

FLOP($.36): 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I check, BB checks, button checks.

TURN($.36): 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

I bet $.10, BB calls, button calls.

RIVER($.66): K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I check, BB bets $.22, button calls, I call (Should I have raised here???).

Comments on this hand????

RESULTS to follow.....

[bunky9590]

River BB bets .22, should have raised pot.

[Paul2432]

Please give the stack sizes. Your questions cannot be answered without knowing the stack sizes.

Paul

[Gomez22]

Thanks Paul... didn't realize stack sizes were important in reviewing NL hands... as I may or may not ahve said, I'm a limit player.....

All stack sizes prior to deal......

I had $2.42
Button had $9.06
BB had $5.93

Hope that helps some..... below is a copy of the hand so you can see it easier:

Stars .01/.02

I'm SB with A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, Button calls $.02, I call, BB raises to $.12, Button calls, I call (should I have re-raised here, and if so, by how much?).

FLOP($.36): 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I check, BB checks, button checks.

TURN($.36): 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

I bet $.10, BB calls, button calls.

RIVER($.66): K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I check, BB bets $.22, button calls, I call (Should I have raised here???).

Comments on this hand????

RESULTS to follow.....

[Nottom]

I don't understand why you didn't raise preflop. When I have AK in the blind I really just want to win the pot right there since I will be out of position the rest of the way.

On the turn, make a bet that matters not that 1/4 pot crap. I would have bet about $.25 if I was gonna bet anything.

I have a feeling that you are chopping this one.

[Gomez22]

MHIG......

I need ALOT of practice at NL, I realize this, but always am thinking others are slowplaying. I really don't know how much to raise with what hands, and how to interpret other's raises.... Completely different world than limit!

Virgin territory is what I am....

[img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

'Mez

[Paul2432]

Gomez22,

Stack sizes are important because in NL you can only bet as much as you have in front of you (or your opponent has in front of him if you have him covered) (the table stakes rule). Often, the correct play is different when the money is deep (i.e. stacks are large relative to the blinds or current size of the pot) compared to when the money is shallow.

For example, on this hand if you only had $0.20 the correct play would probably be to raise all-in when the action first got to you pre-flop. AK is a hand that likes to be all-in before the flop, but generally not for too much money and as the raiser not the caller (so you have the added equity of your opponent folding). If a lot of money goes in pre-flop with AK you are likely up against AA or KK which is a terrible situtation.

Post flop with a lot of money left to bet (say 3x the pot or more) AK needs to be played very carefully especially out of position like you are on this hand. It is a hand that can win a little or lose a lot. On this particular hand if you decide to re-raise pre-flop I think another $0.50 is a good amount, although if you do re-raise you are pretty much committed to the hand. Do you see why? If you get called, you'll have about or perhaps a bit more (depending on the number of callers) than the size of the pot left. Your re-raise represents AA or KK with which you would almost always follow through with on the flop unless the board is very scary. Likewise you should probably follow through with AK here too to force small pairs to fold. This play will probably be successful most of the time, but you are risking your whole stack. If you get re-raised all-in by the BB pre-flop though you can probably safely fold.

On the other hand if you just call the BB's raise, you could have different set of problems unless you flop something like a flush or top pair and a flush draw (in that case you should be very happy to get all your money in). If and A or K comes on the flop and you bet out and get raised you are once again faced with a very tough decision. AK is not an easy hand to play without position after the flop.

On the other hand if your opponents are so passive that they will check to the river and let you hit your hand then you have a good situation. At the higher limits this will generally not happen. You would have been forced to fold on the flop or turn. On this actual hand on the river, I think you played it right. Your hand is much better as a bluff catcher than as a value bettor. I would call the river and expect to chop or win.

BTW, I strongly recommend the Ciaffone/Reuben PL/NL book. These concepts are discussed in much greater detail in this book.

Paul

[tewall]

A standard raise is around 3 or 4 times the big blind. It's a good idea (especially starting out) to make all your raises the same size, so pick an amount and stick to it. That way you avoid giving away information about your hand. If your opponents usually call your raises, then out of position you want to stick to really good hands to raise with (like high pairs and AK). If your opponents usually fold, then you can sometimes mix in other hands.

The idea behind raising AK is two fold. First of all, you want to limit the field. Some hands like to play multiway and others don't. AK doesn't (just like in limit). So you raise to limit the field. The second reason to raise AK is it makes it much easier to play later on in the hand, especially out of position. There's an NL addage which says don't lose all your money in an unraised pot. The meaning is that if there wasn't a raise pre-flop, then your opponents could have anything. So if the flop comes something like A84, you don't know where you are. If you raise pre-flop, it's easier for you to put your opponents on a hand.

One more thought. Just as picking a standard amount to raise pre-flop is a good idea, so is picking a standard amount to bet. I would suggest always betting the pot. This way you avoid giving away information about your hand inadvertantly based on the size of your bets. A pot-sized bet is not often wrong (given that it's right to bet at all).

Another thought is that even though you're playing for small amounts, your stack sizes are quite large, much larger than most of the low limit on-line games. With deep stacks, there's much more skill involved, and the strategies are different than what you will usually see suggested here. For example, with deep stacks, AK is more likely to lose a big pot than win one. It plays much differently when the stacks are smaller, where flopping a top pair/top kicker hand is a strong hand.

[Gomez22]

[ QUOTE ]
The idea behind raising AK is two fold. First of all, you want to limit the field. Some hands like to play multiway and others don't. AK doesn't (just like in limit).

[/ QUOTE ]

I just called the PF raise from BB because I felt I had an opportunity to trap one or both players here if I got a great flop, which I didn't. I bet the turn just to see how interested they were in the hand, and could have folded to a raise, here. The calls by both of them on the turn told me that I has a good possibility of having the best hand, as neither raised me here, but I was still leary about the possibility of being raised on the river if I didn't catch either an ace of king. When the river came a king, I really had no idea where I stood as either of them could have ahd a small pair on the flop with a king kicker, and just hit 2 pair, though, so I decided to just call the bet here. I couldn't have known it pre-flop, but I think if I woulda reraised BB PF, and he showed any aggression on the flop or turn, I may have been hard pressed to call down, being as I only had 6 outs.

[tewall]

You can't trap anyone with AK when the stacks are deep no matter what you flop (except for a miracle TJQ). There are no great flops for AK, which is why you don't want to call. It's very important for AK to knock people out.

If the stacks are deep, and you have AKs, and you have position, calling is very reasonable. But here your thinking is to get a nut straight or flush, not top pair. Top pair just isn't a very good hand in no-limit, which is one of the things which makes no limit much different than limit.

When the stacks are smaller, then top pair/top kicker becomes much better, worth backing with all your chips. But with deep stacks, you're much more likely to lose your stack than double up. Remember that doubling up is the goal.

I think your play of the hand was fine. Betting the turn when the flop was checked through was reasonble. You might take it down, and if not, you could hit one of your 6 (possible) outs. The check-call on the river was very good. A bet is not likely to be called by an inferior hand, one of the pre-requisites for betting on the river. By checking you possibly induce a worse hand to bluff. Raising would be bad for the same reason betting would be. You wouldn't be called by a worse hand, and if you were re-raised you'd have to fold. There'd be no point at all in raising.

Note this is also much different than limit. In limit, betting the river is a much more viable option. Since the bet is small, you are likely to be called by a worse hand since the pot odds would justify calling with many hands worse than KK.

With a good but not great hand, you should almost always check the river out of position. Betting hands should be hands that you figure are good if they are called or bad hands which you hope win as a bluff.