Borgata--They have got to be kidding!

George Rice · #1 11-12-2003, 12:52 AM

Drove down to AC today to check out the Borgata poker room. Not a bad place. Played for a couple of hours. Wasn't too happy with the high rake--10% to $4. But I've seen this before.

As I was leaving I noticed a tournament starting and went over to see the stakes, game etc., for future reference. Was told that it was a $30 tournament. "Is that $30 + ??, or $25 + 5?", I asked. $20 + $10 I was told! Are they serious? $10 fee on a $20 tournament? How's anyone other than the casino supposed to make money?

If they need to charge $10 per head for expenses then the buy-in should be at least $40, assuming re-buys are allowed. Even higher if not. It takes a lot of nerve to charge 50% of the buy-in amount for vig. But I guess if they have suckers who are willing to pay it then they will continue it until the suckers smarten up.

Looking into the future I see a nice new non-smoking slot area where the poker room used to be. Maybe two years at the most.

Easy E · #2 11-12-2003, 11:18 AM

i wouldn't bet on that two year deadline for the room's collapse..

southerndog · #3 11-12-2003, 11:34 AM

Its still a really nice poker room. Hot waitresses, good free beer. I really enjoyed my visit.

ArchAngel71857 · #4 11-12-2003, 12:05 PM

I really enjoy the poker room there. Very nice, everything is new, the plasma TVs everywhere. I picked up a tournament flyer and their rakes were ridiculous, but i've also been there on a tuesday night and it was half full, whether it be spectacle or whatnot. I think they will be around a while.

-AA

Homer · #5 11-12-2003, 03:58 PM

I played in the 20+10 7CS tourney last night. You start with 1000 in chips and can do an add-on for $20 to get 2000 more chips. So really it works out to be a 40+10 tourney with 3000 starting chips. I don't know if the $10 fee is high or not since I rarely play tourneys, but it didn't seem like a bad value to me. I busted out 25th of 66 and got to play for about 3.5 hrs. The levels went up rather slowly, so it didn't seem to be a crapshoot.

-- Homer

Ray Zee · #6 11-12-2003, 07:45 PM

sure it is a terrible value. but small stakesw with the current high rakes that are now the norm are basically not a good play unless you are one of the best at the tables. moving up a few notches to higher limits let many marginal players eeck out a living. and of couse sends some to the poor house.
remember the house wants to make about 100plus an hour off each table so at small stakes you get clobbered with the rake.

mosch · #7 11-12-2003, 11:53 PM

The rake on low-limit sucks at pretty much everything but home games and online. I wouldn't play B&M 2/4 or 3/6 for anything other than entertainment purposes.

The Borgata is one of the nicest poker rooms around, and by far the nicest one in AC, I have trouble imagining that it will have any trouble surviving. Best of all, it's clean. Clean tables, chairs and chips. Everything in the Taj needs to be powerwashed, especially some of the regulars.

George Rice · #8 11-13-2003, 01:37 AM

I agree that it's the nicest room in AC. Trop used to be pretty good too (I haven't been there in a while). And the Taj was the dirtiest there. But the Taj had most of the players because of the size and choice of games, as well as the live ones. The Trop always seemed to be struggling and eventually gave up some of its space to slots.

My reasoning that the room won't last is based on a combination of things. Foremost is the high rake and buy-in fees on its tourneys. Although the other AC rooms may not be much better. The second is the casio operations overall. Their new building cost a bundle and it is away from the boardwalk, meaning the "bus people" visiting will for the most part be those that go directly there--no visitors from the other casions. They didn't have a lot of gaming tables and the slot areas seem smaller than average, unless there was another location I didn't see (like at Foxwoods). So I think they will insist on making a certain amount from their poker room which will be hard to do if they don't regularly keep it filled. Plus the poker room has to contend with online poker where the rakes are lower.

Having said all of that, the new influx of players may in fact make a big enough difference that they will survive with the high vigs, at least for a while.

ACPlayer · #9 11-13-2003, 03:58 PM

Everything in the Taj needs to be powerwashed, especially some of the regulars.

Great line. Thanks.

ACPlayer · #10 11-13-2003, 04:04 PM

I too am pessimistic about Borgata and poker. Here are some reasons:

1. The casual player off the boardwalk is not there. To me this is a source of easy money during the summer. Related to this is that the game selection at the Taj is much better at all times.
2. The poker smokers have to go up the escalator in order to smoke. No place to dash to and puff away and dash back.
3. Their food area sucks
4. Their food options are expensive (eg the noodle bar is twice as expensive as the Taj, though better).

While I would rather play at the Borgata for the surroundings I would rather play at the Taj for the games. No contest!